Does anyone else see a noticeable imbalance in 4AA this season? From what I’m seeing, it’s Myers Park, Mallard Creek, Vance and Richmond (in no particular order) and everyone else. West Forsyth is rolling right now, but I wouldn’t quite yet put them in that group. I know it’s early and anything can happen, but barring injuries, I don’t see the gap closing. It’ll be a war in the west again. If Richmond goes west, that region will be brutal. If they go east, I’d bet the house on Richmond making the final, with one of the three I mentioned going to the final from the west. West Forsyth is having a great year so far but they’d be facing a very tough stretch in the playoffs. I have my thoughts but would like those more knowledgeable to share about what’s contributing to the imbalance, at least as I perceive it?
4AA Imbalance?
- Thread starter mrhonda
- Start date
No doubt the west been stronger for awhile. If the RAIDERS go east pencil us in for the championship game. In the west may get there our maybe win one game. 4aa west should really be called Charlotte versus Richmond.
Yes I pretty much agree with your comments. However I think if Richmond went east they would be the favorite but not a slam dunk to win the east. I recall them going east about 5 or 6 years ago with everybody thinking they would waltz to the title game but they got beat by Jack Britt
I'm not a Richmond fan but I do admit if Richmond was seeded in the east they would likely have at least 4 or 5 more title game appearances over the time period since the split playoffs have begun.
I'm not a Richmond fan but I do admit if Richmond was seeded in the east they would likely have at least 4 or 5 more title game appearances over the time period since the split playoffs have begun.
Dont sleep on this leesville rd team in the east. I dont know a lot about them but from what I'm hearing they were good last yr and they jus added to that this yr.
I know logistically it doesn't make sense, but I would like to see a non-directional playoff. The 4-AA West is definitely brutal and from year to year you always see teams that would easily be in the Final 4 possibly get knocked out the playoffs early based on geography (The West region). As good as Wake Forest has been the last few years I'm not sure they stand tall playing Vance, Mallard Creek, MP or even Hough in back to back playoff games. Just my take.
"stronger for a while"? No doubt Charlotte has the best concentration of athletes and the best programs but one might look at the result that counts, the championship game the past 3 years before they start making claims about the past. Right now, ok? But for a while now?
Wake Forest no doubt about it, has taken care of business in the championship game the last few years.
Seed the teams based on best to worst no matter where they are located and it would fix some of this. Now some would argue about a team in the mountains going to the coast but i don't think you would have a lot of that. Other than that I'm not sure what else you could do?
First, it’s great that RC is back in the discussion. Always better when they are in the mix. Charlotte is by far the best area in the state for high end football. However, that was not always the case and other areas are trying to catch up. I feel Raleigh football is moving in that direction as is the Triad. Fayetteville just hasn’t been able to get to a higher level. New schools have hurt them but every major city in NC is dealing with new schools. Many kids are moving into Charlotte schools because high school football is so well covered and many college coaches basically live there. A lot of media and college coaches around make for a good formula.
Port is Carolina Forest that good. I know they have a big line and Garcia but it looks like they gave you all a tough time.
I'm from Fayetteville and football has definitely declined in a big way here since about the early 2000s. Doesn't seem to be coming back any time soon either. Overall enrollment has taken a substantial hit with more and more families electing to move to Hoke , Harnett or other surrounding counties. Fayetteville is left with only one 4AA program in Britt. But even the schools that have dropped down to 3A dont even seem to be making any noise at that level. 71st is still respectable in 4A but that's about it. Very mediocre football across the board here currently when it once was seemingly at or near the top on a state level.
I think that a reason why alot of families are moving to Hoke and Harnett counties from Fayetteville is essentially the aging house market here. With Fort Bragg here the base itself takes up alot of close land possibilities for new construction. Most of the existing neighborhoods in the city were built in the 60s and the neighborhoods have naturally declined and not as attractive to potential home buyers. Britt and Cape Fear and Grays Creek areas seem to be the only areas for potential growth and new houses and it's no coincidence that Britt is the only 4AA school. But they are so close to the Hoke line that they may not be able to fit in more houses in there.
An example is that I grew up in the west side and went to Westover which was opened in the 77-78 school year. At the time it was a good school and the neighborhoods respectable. We just had to sell our old house when my Mom passed away and we couldn't sell it for 3 years and finally had to sell it for just 25k. Due to the age of the houses in the neighborhood and in the other neighborhoods for Westover even if your house is still nice there you may get 70K tops for your house there in the district
Kids are not playing football in Fayetteville like they did and I know that is every where but some of the best athletes are opting out of football as well. Also there is a lot of movement of kids to play in those areas you mentioned. The demise of football at Byrd, Westover and E.E. Smith is sad. There has been talk of closing Smith and building a new school that would house both students from Smith and Westover. I think that would help. Also with 295 about to be completed in the next few years I think you will see more new housing coming in around that loop. That should help as well.
We you talk about 4AA east you are only talking about the Raleigh area. I bet there aren't four 4AA schools east of I-95.
They are very good. I look for them to give MB all they want and then some this Friday. We didn’t matchup well with them plus 5 starters hurt on an already thin team.
i bet you are right its hardly any east or south of Raleigh. Lumberton, Britt, Hoggard, RC and Pinecrest are the only ones I can think of. Southview can go either way.
4A-4AA football has been top heavy for awhile now especially in Charlotte. Also in the Raleigh area it is WF and whomever decides to rise up for a year or two before falling off again. Putting this in prospective, everyone talks about the elite teams in Charlotte as they should but there are more than a few 3A and a couple of 2A schools that will run roughshod through the South Meck 7 in football. The 4AA west bracket on the other hand is like gladiator wars just to get to the Western final let alone the state title game.
My mom lives in Fayetteville for 45 years. I've seen some good football there in past years. 71 St and South view used to be teams to beat there. Then came Jack Britt,they were very good program for years. EE Smith,Terry Sanford,Pinecrest,Cape Fear. Used to be good rivalry's in that city. Alot are 3A now due to enrollment kids going to rural areas,Grey's Creek.
East of Fayetteville we don't have 4A schools until you get to Wilmington.
4 schools there all 4A and are good teams 3 anyway year in and out.
There is very good football in our 2A schools here in East Whiteville,Wallace Rose Hill, East duplin,James Kenan
South Columbus East Bladen. I like wing- T football,so that's where I go.
We also have some very good coach's here. Sometimes schools here have been placed in West in playoffs,and did pretty good against dominant West team,like Murphy,E.Surry,ect. But Charlotte is big time with prime time players. RPO offense like colleges.
I love High School football but numbers are down and that disappoints me. But I'll be at a 2A game this Friday watching a good ground game.
East of Fayetteville we don't have 4A schools until you get to Wilmington.
4 schools there all 4A and are good teams 3 anyway year in and out.
There is very good football in our 2A schools here in East Whiteville,Wallace Rose Hill, East duplin,James Kenan
South Columbus East Bladen. I like wing- T football,so that's where I go.
We also have some very good coach's here. Sometimes schools here have been placed in West in playoffs,and did pretty good against dominant West team,like Murphy,E.Surry,ect. But Charlotte is big time with prime time players. RPO offense like colleges.
I love High School football but numbers are down and that disappoints me. But I'll be at a 2A game this Friday watching a good ground game.
Portcity,why can't Ashley have a competitive team with big enrollment there? Just wondering,they had 4 coach's there,hopefully Wilson Helms can turn things around. Thanks
Their demographic isn't good for football. Many kids that are promising transfer to NH or Hoggard because the program is so weak.
Britt was just recently in 4A this year when they are usually in the 4AA discussion. Can Laney compete? I hear they have great athletes and with all the schools opening up in Raleigh with high enrollment, it will be hard for other schools further east. I know Hoggard was 4AA last year which was the first in many years right?
What are the chances that if things stay the same with the next realingment, then Britt and 71st will be apart of the patriot conference and leave the SAC 8? or if things change and we get a 5A then it would be Raleigh vs Charlotte all the time, with some richmond sprinkled in there
What are the chances that if things stay the same with the next realingment, then Britt and 71st will be apart of the patriot conference and leave the SAC 8? or if things change and we get a 5A then it would be Raleigh vs Charlotte all the time, with some richmond sprinkled in there
If 5A is 12.5% of the schools there will be 48 schools in the classification (and 48 football playing schools in 1A). Out of the 48 largest schools using 2018 football ADM there were 15 schools not located in Wake or Meck counties. There may have been a few more that are bordering Wake County but I am not as familiar with the schools there.
Triad has been good/decent. Raleigh area only has Wake Forest.
Wake County has 28 high schools whereas Mecklenburg County, with a bigger population has 21. Mecklenburg County schools are more crowded. The largest ADMs are Mecklenburg County schools like Myers Park (3513), Kell(3406), South Meck (3215), Mallard (2594) vs. Wake Forest (2285), Middle Creek (2049) and Gibbons (1581). 500-700 more students sure helps, especially when you factor in demographics: Wake County is 19% Black whereas Mecklenburg County is 28% black. I know folks don't like to discuss it, but if you look at the NFL, you get my point. Bottom line is that Mecklenburg County has a higher concentration of football athletes compared to anyone else in the state.
Based on your logic, Winston Salem and Greensboro have more 'football' athletes than Char/Meck.
Anyway Charlotte-704 area puts alot more resources(and have alot more access to resources) into football than most areas in NC.
Guilford County is about the same as Meck at 30%; Forsyth a bit less at 24%. Both have a bunch of good athletes, they just don't have the overall population. Wake and Meck are exploding. Forsyth is flat and Guilford is in decline. Guilford historically has had much better football results and produced a bunch more NFL players than Forsyth.
What a lot of people assume when they put up admin numbers? That because a school with high admin numbers, means that more kids are trying out for football. Which is false. Mallard Creek had less than 35 Ninth graders per year try out for football the last 3 years. I can assure you there are 2A schools with higher numbers. People just don’t take into consideration, that there’s a lot to do in Charlotte for kids, outside of playing football.
also some admin numbers don't take into thought about schools with high numbers that have high HISPANIC concentrations that don't participate in any sports other than soccer...
Exactly if that was the case should give Olympic a championship along with South Meck. My sister-in-law lives by Olympic and that schools has twice the population as a lot of the 4a schools.
I am pretty sure Wake County does not have 28 public high schools with football teams. I think it is 23. Meck County has 19. Wake County has the most students of any school system in the state and a larger amount of students in 9-12 and than Meck.
If you are include private schools I think it would be closer to even. Charlotte private school football has been way advanced over most of the state for several years.
You forgot Green Hope (2765), Enloe (2734), Broughton (2595), Leesville Road (2551), Friendship (2501). Granted new school openings will lower those just as the two new schools planned for CMS will lower their total in a few years.
Laney has the best draw in town. They have the athletes to compete year in and year out. They are also loosing players at a high rate. When NH won the 3A state championship a few years back they had 8 players starting that lived in Laney district. This has been going on for the past 15 years. Laney is a powerhouse in the waiting.
It's funny reading this...a admin numbers and metro areas have more access to this etc. Could it b that the culture at certain schools are different than other schools? Besides the varsity which is the finished product...the jv, middle, and 14u teams maybe jus flat out good which results in the varsity being good. Catholic coaches their kids early in the wing T which results in them being a contender in 4A and now 3A. Same with MC, Butler, and until a few yrs ago Indy. Hell even Vance's feeder James Martin middle years back went something like a decade without losing a damn game. Until Brand came Vance always been pegged having great athletes we jus didnt have the culture, coaching, leadership til Brand came in and left his fingerprint. U bring the right coach or AD in any district, put the right people in the right places...within 5 yrs that team will b good....period.
You are correct, there are 28 schools, but only 25 have sports. The other 3 are some sort of technical schools. I stand corrected. I still think it helps to have a concentration of athletes. The fact that only 35 freshmen went out for football is telling, but only so much. Football enrollment across the country is falling dramatically, especially amongst kids from families with high incomes. You can bet that the 35 that went out for Mallard Creek were studs. Once in their weight program, they will likely flourish. By comparison, a school in Chapel Hill had to drop football altogether. Apex has about 30 if you count varsity and JV together. It just pays to have the studs. That's all.
- Apex Friendship High School (Patriots)
- Apex High School (Cougars)
- Athens Drive High School (Jaguars)
- Cary High School (Imps)
- East Wake High School (Warriors)
- Fuquay-Varina High School (Bengals)
- Garner High School (Trojans)
- Green Hope High School (Falcons)
- Green Level High School (Gators)
- Heritage High School (Huskies)
- Holly Springs High School (Golden Hawks)
- Jesse O. Sanderson High School (Spartans)
- Knightdale High School (Knights)
- Leesville Road High School (Pride)
- Middle Creek High School (Mustangs)
- Millbrook High School (Wildcats)
- Needham B. Broughton High School (Capitals)
- Panther Creek High School (Catamounts)
- Rolesville High School (Rams)
- Southeast Raleigh High School (Bulldogs)
- South Garner High School (Titans)
- Wake Forest High School (Cougars)
- Wakefield High School (Wolverines)
- William G. Enloe High School (Eagles)
- Willow Spring High School (unknown)
So now all the homes that are sold in the 28269 area code for Mallard Creek, The parents only have kids that are studs on the Football field? Maybe the real estate agents in the area, are doing combines for kids at Mallard Creek before they sell them a house or rent an apartment. That sounds logical?
Willow Springs is Fuquay Varina students until the FV campus is rebuilt. They play sports as FV. FV is scheduled to reopen for the 2021-22 school year.
Green Level will not field varsity football until next year as they are a 9-10 School only this year.
Green Level will not field varsity football until next year as they are a 9-10 School only this year.
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