POLL: Hayesville or Bishop
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This a question does not hold merit. Hayesville won their state championships with a boundary school with a very small population within the boundary. They had players from a boundary with only the small town of Hayesville and the very rural and mountainous area. Bishop has students from two very large metropolitan cities. Thus, in my opinion there is no comparison.
I haven't voted in your asinine poll since neither should be diminished. By the way if you start a poll at least you should know how many Hayesville won, not "6 or 7" and how many Bishop has won. Lastly, quit calling other posters "dumba$$es", if you want to insult them use the word.
This post was edited on 12/3 6:54 PM by Deana_King
This post was edited on 12/3 6:54 PM by Deana_King
I think it is very disrespectful BK to come on a chat board and ask people for their opinion. There is no reason to come right out and ask me what I think, it is just wrong. As you will be able to tell by other posts, this board is strictly for facts and you should not be encouraging people to have an opinion. LMAO
I did vote and I can assure that I was not one of the 3.
I did vote and I can assure that I was not one of the 3.
Actually BK I was one of the three but I wasnt paying attention and clicked the wrong one haha, so there is only two I am only a dumb@$$ for the fact that i clicked the wrong one
So you edit my post but have no problem with "dumba$$"as long as they spell it like that....par for the course. I guess you're now back in the moderator mode and not giving your personal opinion. By the way does Starmount have any 6'9" Peurto Rican kids coming in to live with coaches in order to play basketball? How about Mt. airy having a 6'7" center playing for them who lives in Elkin.
By the way both Bishop and WSPrep are 1A members in good standing with the NCHSAA. Get over it if you don't like it (speaking to you personally and not in your ADMIN position)
This post was edited on 12/3 7:31 PM by 3daughters
By the way both Bishop and WSPrep are 1A members in good standing with the NCHSAA. Get over it if you don't like it (speaking to you personally and not in your ADMIN position)
This post was edited on 12/3 7:31 PM by 3daughters
3daughters I believe there is a slight difference in the word you used and the one BK used. Not that either one is necessarily appropriate, but the father of 3 daughters using that word in a public forum, come on now.
god forbid that I use a "bad" word to the guy who starts an insulting poll diminishing the program my daughters have played for. Same crap over and over and no problem for the mods in the least.
3D you know who got all of this started on another thread.
Also if a kid lives in elkin and plays for another school report it. It is against the rules and someone could forfeit some games for it. That problem can be fixed. Just think about this. We cant report BM for doing this because they get special treatment. They are aloud to do it. They past a rule in the spring that kids cant move out of district unless they sit out one year but this isnt the case for some SPECIAL schools. Those titles are a joke!!!. Not the kids fault but what is it teaching them? Cant wait for one of these schools to win a 1a football state title. Then it will be corrected!!!
Also if a kid lives in elkin and plays for another school report it. It is against the rules and someone could forfeit some games for it. That problem can be fixed. Just think about this. We cant report BM for doing this because they get special treatment. They are aloud to do it. They past a rule in the spring that kids cant move out of district unless they sit out one year but this isnt the case for some SPECIAL schools. Those titles are a joke!!!. Not the kids fault but what is it teaching them? Cant wait for one of these schools to win a 1a football state title. Then it will be corrected!!!
Just think how quick it would be corrected if it were the same for the other classifications. The other classifications have no interest since it doesnt affect them....
Its got alot to do with money. I dont respect my own state because of this. Its not hard to see why some people say they are buying titles at these schools. I would hate for my Kids to win a title at one of these school. Sooner or later she would figure out what was going on.
Both runs are very impressive. I do wish there were separate classes for traditional schools and charters/parochials however.
I also wish I could've gotten to see the Bishop girls play in 2A. They would've more than held their own most years.
I also wish I could've gotten to see the Bishop girls play in 2A. They would've more than held their own most years.
Really, BK, and just how has Bishop bought their titles? You keep saying it is about the money, how so?
"Starmount...we're a boundary school but our boundary extends beyond the continental United States".
"Starmount...we're a boundary school but our boundary extends beyond the continental United States".
Dosso am I wrong in thinking that the rule was changed this spring and local boards no longer have that option? I have been told that they did. That loophole had been a real problem and I hope that I am right that it has been fixed. Now if they would change the rules that Forsyth county takes advantage of we would be making some progress.
It's not single players it's common practice. Twins from South Davidson (probably best they've had in years) transfer to Davie County for junior year and then transfer to Mt. Tabor in Forsyth County for senior year. Three high schools in 3 different counties in 3 years all while living in the same residence. NO ONE raised an eyebrow on these boards. "Boundary schools" my foot. Try again.
Yes Alleghany 84 you are generally correct. Kids can still transfer within a school district, so a student can still transfer from N. Surry to E. Surry, but a kid from N. Surry can't transfer to N. Stokes without a waiver from the NCHSAA apparently. I am not sure how hard it is to get that waiver. But didn't the Daily kid just transfer from Mt. Airy to N. Surry, and I think he does not live in either district. Transfers to McGuinness from a NC public school still have to sit out a year. Some counties like Forsyth and Wake and others have open enrollment so you an also go to whatever school you want in those counties. And again remember that WS Prep is a magnet and not a charter.
Wow you cite one family. Ok, now how many players at bishop live in another school's district? How many schools have lost players to bishop? I will say that there is a 99% chance that bishop has more players from another district than most if not all 1A schools.
By the way did you not just recently state that you don't call out specific players? Your very consistent.
What "affects BM"? Also BK, you kept saying multiple times it's all about the money, again, how so?
This post was edited on 12/5 12:44 PM by 3daughters
This post was edited on 12/5 12:44 PM by 3daughters
Yes. BK is asking which is a more impressive accomplishment. The two choices are:
Hayesville- 6 straight state titles. 8 players that went on to play D-1. Had about 300-325 students in the entire county. 0 players involved in AAU ball.
Bishop- 9 titles. Able to have students from anywhere enroll and play for them. Had many students that live in other schools districts. Most of their players came from the Winston-Salem Greensboro area. Multiple players involved in AAU, usually in a program that was overseen by their coach.
if I have made any factual errors please let me know.
Definition of 1A School - Small town or rural community as a community where we sit on the bleachers or sidelines and watch our kids play ball. T ball to varsity this community supports those kids as they grow up. In the winter we watch them play football, volleyball and soccer. Our basketball and wrestling programs waits patiently for the fall sports to finish. Let me say that again. They wait for those same athletes to finish if the fall sports are lucky and good enough to be playing in the playoffs. Those parents who sit in football stands or volleyball bleachers are the same ones who are watching basketball. Same goes for winter to spring transition. I could go on and on about why most of us dislike the current system that allows schools like BM and Winston-Salem Prep to compete in the 1A division
Let me add to my previous post....I'm not taking away from the accomplishments of BM and
WSP. Their parents should be just as proud as we are of our kids. With that said lets get back to the topic. The only thing our small town community schools have in common with the likes of BM and WSP is the 1A stuck in front of our classification. Those schools are within the rules but that does not mean that we like it. It's not sour grapes. It`s an unfair advantage. Our kids deserve to be playing in state championship games against other small town teams. That's what 1A means !!
WSP. Their parents should be just as proud as we are of our kids. With that said lets get back to the topic. The only thing our small town community schools have in common with the likes of BM and WSP is the 1A stuck in front of our classification. Those schools are within the rules but that does not mean that we like it. It's not sour grapes. It`s an unfair advantage. Our kids deserve to be playing in state championship games against other small town teams. That's what 1A means !!
Recycle - so 1A athletes should not be playing in AAU? NONE of Hayesville's players were AAU? You better bring that up with the coaches at Mt Airy, East Surry and several other teams that had athletes in the same program as BM.
Recycled so Hayesville had 8 D1 players in their 6 year run. How many D1 players has Bishop had in their 9 year run since you are comparing the 2? If Bishop has won 3 more title against far better competition with less D1 players what would that mean?
This post was edited on 12/6 4:27 PM by 3daughters
This post was edited on 12/6 4:27 PM by 3daughters
3D, how can you be so dense? It means that Hayesville developed their players from their small rural communities. They did not get players from a large urban area. It means Hayesville had to take their kids and "coach them up". If Hayesville had the same resources they may have won 15? 20? Who knows? Even you admit that BM has "advantages". You tell me how did HHS do this without any players in AAU or even in a summer league? With the "advantages" of BM why have they not produced more D-1 kids?
3D, very simple HHS did more with far fewer resources.
Silversides, no one in Hayesville's streak played AAU.
no recycled, I am not dense. I have not voted in the poll becausethe poll is here for only 1 reason, to take another shot at Bishop McGuinness. Since you stated facts, here as some more:
1. There has aways been complete transparency as to where the Bishop girls attended middle school. Almost all of them are from Catholic schools so if you want a "district" there it is.
2. The Cathoic feeder shools are very small. They start playing in the ultra competitive PESCA league in the 5th grade. The coaching at that level for fundamentals is extraordinary.
3. A good number of the very good Catholic kids never go to Bishop.Example: for the last two years St. Pius middle school went 60-0 winnng multiple prestigious tournaments. All 12 players played AAU, only 1 for the Winston-Salem Steelers. Of the 7 eighth graders only 1 went to Bishop, 4 went to Page and 2 went to Greensboro Day. Expect Page to be very very good.
4. 3 of the 10 players this year are from the small Catholic school in High Point. Number of total girls in that eighth grade:14
5. Bishop has had 6 D1 players durung their 9 year run. The first two were Catholic kids from the same small Catholic school. The third went to a public middle school and played for Bishop for 2 years before leaving becasue the family could not afford the tuition cost. The fourth never attended public schools, only faith based schools. Came to Bishop for the religious aspect and to be coached by Brian Robinson (nce to have a coach of the US National team coaching our daughters every day). The fifth and sixth are both Catholic girls, one now going to Harvard and the second a preferred walkon at Western Carolina.
6. Bishop has not even dominated their own conference. Last year was their first conference title since 2009. Their success in the state tournament is in part because of East Surry, Mt. Airy, etc
7. Bishops teams are rarely athletic. They are smart, disciplined and extremey well coached. Their total philosphy is to grow throughout the season and be prepard for the state tournament. This year they stand at 0-2 at the bottom of the standings but don't count them out come tourney time. Testament to the "program" and their mental toughness. Anyone wanting to play for Bishop better have a thick skin. I used to ask my daughter if it bothered her to seeminly always be in the "dog house" and her answer was an unequivocal "no". Her reason was that she was 5-3, was not quick or athletic and she needed to be tough as nails and more fundamentally sound that the taller, quicker more athletic girl opposing her. (look up the national records froml last year and see which school was near the top in charges taken...says a great deal about their tougness. To say that some day my daughter will "figure it out" is insulting to her.
In no way would any Bishop fan ever try to diminsh the accomplishemnt of the Hayesville program. Their run was extraordinary.
I have not "called out" any kids in this thread. Ihave pointed out that the concept of "boundary schools" is hardly factual across the state but rarely if ever heae complaints.
All of us Bishop parents and fans "get it" why you are frustrated and angry when it comes to girls basketball. I'm sure the WS Prep parents and fans understand your anger and frustration. I aslo know that the same angry fans can't wait to see Bishop on ther football schedule Over the years it has been alledged that Bishop recruits- it does't. It has been alledged that Bishop gives scholarships to help athletes attend-it doesn't.
Again, this poll is here for the sole purpose of attackng Bishop McGuinness.
This post was edited on 12/7 11:22 AM by 3daughters
This post was edited on 12/7 12:21 PM by 3daughters
1. There has aways been complete transparency as to where the Bishop girls attended middle school. Almost all of them are from Catholic schools so if you want a "district" there it is.
2. The Cathoic feeder shools are very small. They start playing in the ultra competitive PESCA league in the 5th grade. The coaching at that level for fundamentals is extraordinary.
3. A good number of the very good Catholic kids never go to Bishop.Example: for the last two years St. Pius middle school went 60-0 winnng multiple prestigious tournaments. All 12 players played AAU, only 1 for the Winston-Salem Steelers. Of the 7 eighth graders only 1 went to Bishop, 4 went to Page and 2 went to Greensboro Day. Expect Page to be very very good.
4. 3 of the 10 players this year are from the small Catholic school in High Point. Number of total girls in that eighth grade:14
5. Bishop has had 6 D1 players durung their 9 year run. The first two were Catholic kids from the same small Catholic school. The third went to a public middle school and played for Bishop for 2 years before leaving becasue the family could not afford the tuition cost. The fourth never attended public schools, only faith based schools. Came to Bishop for the religious aspect and to be coached by Brian Robinson (nce to have a coach of the US National team coaching our daughters every day). The fifth and sixth are both Catholic girls, one now going to Harvard and the second a preferred walkon at Western Carolina.
6. Bishop has not even dominated their own conference. Last year was their first conference title since 2009. Their success in the state tournament is in part because of East Surry, Mt. Airy, etc
7. Bishops teams are rarely athletic. They are smart, disciplined and extremey well coached. Their total philosphy is to grow throughout the season and be prepard for the state tournament. This year they stand at 0-2 at the bottom of the standings but don't count them out come tourney time. Testament to the "program" and their mental toughness. Anyone wanting to play for Bishop better have a thick skin. I used to ask my daughter if it bothered her to seeminly always be in the "dog house" and her answer was an unequivocal "no". Her reason was that she was 5-3, was not quick or athletic and she needed to be tough as nails and more fundamentally sound that the taller, quicker more athletic girl opposing her. (look up the national records froml last year and see which school was near the top in charges taken...says a great deal about their tougness. To say that some day my daughter will "figure it out" is insulting to her.
In no way would any Bishop fan ever try to diminsh the accomplishemnt of the Hayesville program. Their run was extraordinary.
I have not "called out" any kids in this thread. Ihave pointed out that the concept of "boundary schools" is hardly factual across the state but rarely if ever heae complaints.
All of us Bishop parents and fans "get it" why you are frustrated and angry when it comes to girls basketball. I'm sure the WS Prep parents and fans understand your anger and frustration. I aslo know that the same angry fans can't wait to see Bishop on ther football schedule Over the years it has been alledged that Bishop recruits- it does't. It has been alledged that Bishop gives scholarships to help athletes attend-it doesn't.
Again, this poll is here for the sole purpose of attackng Bishop McGuinness.
This post was edited on 12/7 11:22 AM by 3daughters
This post was edited on 12/7 12:21 PM by 3daughters
yea BK I would be happy to have you talk to my daughter to make sure that she "understands it". And she will tell you the life lessons she learned playing high school basketball and the lessons that she learned playing softball for Bishop and getting outscored 242-0 in conference play. No gloating when she put on 4 state rings and no moaning when the mercy rule was applied in every softball game.
Many many games over 4 years I watched her play quarters and halves passing up wide open layups and shots in order to not run up the score to embarrass their competitors. The team, players and coaches, have never had a single technical foul. When Wendy Shumate at North Wilkes beats a team 120-7 my daughter couldn't understand why that would ever happen and was so proud that Brian Robinson would never do anything like that. She could have cared less about her stats, she would have no clue about how many points she sored, only if she had a turnover, didn't block out enough or didn't take another charge even though she was beat to a pulp each game. She wanted to be a great teammate and a true sportsman on and off the court and field She was an exemplary high school athlete BK in every sense of the word and someday may be coaching other young ladies and they will be better off for the lessons she learned playing for Bishop McGuinness.
So yea BK. tell me again how I should be embarrassed for my daughter.
Many many games over 4 years I watched her play quarters and halves passing up wide open layups and shots in order to not run up the score to embarrass their competitors. The team, players and coaches, have never had a single technical foul. When Wendy Shumate at North Wilkes beats a team 120-7 my daughter couldn't understand why that would ever happen and was so proud that Brian Robinson would never do anything like that. She could have cared less about her stats, she would have no clue about how many points she sored, only if she had a turnover, didn't block out enough or didn't take another charge even though she was beat to a pulp each game. She wanted to be a great teammate and a true sportsman on and off the court and field She was an exemplary high school athlete BK in every sense of the word and someday may be coaching other young ladies and they will be better off for the lessons she learned playing for Bishop McGuinness.
So yea BK. tell me again how I should be embarrassed for my daughter.
3D, you say that you didn't call out any students? What were your intentions when you mentions a set of twins and players from Elkin and Mt Airy?
Your post also points out yet another advantage for bishop. In HHS's run they did not have a middle school team, just a rec league usually coached by parents. Bishop has an advantage over every school now, their students can play on school sponsored teams starting in the 5th grade. All public middle school teams must wait till students must are in the.7th grade to participate. Wow, 2 additional years with fundamental coaching. I just wonder how Bishop's record would be on a level playing field. Please continue to take pride in your accomplishments. But let me ask a few questions, do you defend bishop out of a sense of guilt? Or is it that you think that it is these advantages that are responsible for their edge that makes them successful and you are in denial?
Your post also points out yet another advantage for bishop. In HHS's run they did not have a middle school team, just a rec league usually coached by parents. Bishop has an advantage over every school now, their students can play on school sponsored teams starting in the 5th grade. All public middle school teams must wait till students must are in the.7th grade to participate. Wow, 2 additional years with fundamental coaching. I just wonder how Bishop's record would be on a level playing field. Please continue to take pride in your accomplishments. But let me ask a few questions, do you defend bishop out of a sense of guilt? Or is it that you think that it is these advantages that are responsible for their edge that makes them successful and you are in denial?
It's not even a question, Hayesville's run was far more impressive. It's a complete joke that teams like Bishop McGuinness Catholic School are even allowed to play in the 1A playoffs. This has been hashed and rehashed on here multiple times (charter, private, parochial, traditional public, non-boundary, etc.) and it seems nothing changes from year to year. Until something changes, all the "traditional" public schools can do is go out and play their best against who the NCHSAA puts in front of them come playoff time. I'm personally in favor of a +1 system like other states have implemented.
not "calling out" anyone. It iis well known where these players lived. They did not break any rules, all were great players and a huge advantage for the teams they played for. The concept of a "boundary school" in this part of the state has many many excptions.
Many times over the years I and other Bishop posters have talked about the advantage of the PESCA league for girls basketball. Just like the reverse for Bishop football where most of the players have played no organized football before entering their freshman year. A huge disadvantage for Bishop football. Bishop girls playing softball have never played orgainized softball before their freshman year. A huge diisadvantage for Bishop softball.
The point is that Bishop basketball does have an advantage but it is not because of their drawing area since they draw from the Catholic popolation and even then only from a part of the Catholic population. They do not draw from the AAU population bcause almost all of the girls playing in their conferene play AAU, many on the same teams.
Again the whole purpose behind this poll is to take another cheap shot at Bishop. It was not titled "which streak was more impressive" it was titled "which one was less worthy". Big difference. If the poll was which streak was more impressive I may have even voted for Hayesville which would not in the least diminish what Bishop has done. There cerainly is no denial or guilt. Just another cheap shot at Bishop.
This post was edited on 12/7 3:56 PM by 3daughters
Many times over the years I and other Bishop posters have talked about the advantage of the PESCA league for girls basketball. Just like the reverse for Bishop football where most of the players have played no organized football before entering their freshman year. A huge disadvantage for Bishop football. Bishop girls playing softball have never played orgainized softball before their freshman year. A huge diisadvantage for Bishop softball.
The point is that Bishop basketball does have an advantage but it is not because of their drawing area since they draw from the Catholic popolation and even then only from a part of the Catholic population. They do not draw from the AAU population bcause almost all of the girls playing in their conferene play AAU, many on the same teams.
Again the whole purpose behind this poll is to take another cheap shot at Bishop. It was not titled "which streak was more impressive" it was titled "which one was less worthy". Big difference. If the poll was which streak was more impressive I may have even voted for Hayesville which would not in the least diminish what Bishop has done. There cerainly is no denial or guilt. Just another cheap shot at Bishop.
This post was edited on 12/7 3:56 PM by 3daughters
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