Thomasville vs East Davidson- who ya got
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Dogs86mvp. It is amazing how armchair quarterbacks always think it is coaching that loses games. I don't have a dog in the fight. But the coaches were at a lose lose situation at the 50 yard line with 4th down. If you go for it, you keep the kids in the game because it shows you believe in them. You punt, and you have lost all continuity you have developed. On the other hand if you go for it. The experts in the stands always think they have the answers and you have lost the fan base. And now, especially in Thomasville, they think this is the same talent pool as the state title teams. Not the case. And I supposed the two unsportsmanlike penalties are the coaches fault too. Those kids went into defense mood as soon as the adversity set it. Those 30 yards made a difference.
Not a lose lose lose situation at all it's called field position! No one has said anything about the unsportsmanlike penalties but since you did you would know that unsportsmanlike penalties are a direct reflection of coaching! If you have read the rest of the posts on here you will see most Thomasville fans have acknowledged this isn't the same talent as the state titles teams.
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I doubt many posters are referring to the fourth down attempts. Rather it's about the formations that don't put these particular players in a position to be successful. About the lack of any imagination in calling plays. About the failure to discipline players who need it. About the unwillingness to make adjustments. About the lack of in-game coaching on the sidelines.
You're right that the talent level isn't there like it used to be. Neither is the discipline. But even Coach Brown struggled with the discipline issues his last four or five years. But he was able to overcome them to some degree with a great coaching mind and an excellent staff.
There's plenty of blame to go around. But, as I've said many times, the buck stops at the very top. If it is clear to players that arrests, gang activity, lack of academic effort, and inappropriate conduct on and off the field aren't accepted, you've solved one major problem. And the coaches have to model the behavior you want and be willing to hold players accountable.
You also have to find skilled, proven assistants. Vance Hanner at East is doing all of that. And the results show it.
You can only control the talent level so much. But the rest of the ingredients are up to the administration, the school board, the staff and the community.
Thomasville doesn't have the same horses they once did to run power football. They are actually more suited to run the spread like they do but their QB isn't the best passer in the world, they run a lot of fakes and read option out of it. They have a lot of smaller, real athletic kids but they are playing inconsistent right now, up one week and down the next but I will say they played a hard fought game tonight. They just ran into a very talented team who played hard too.
Our coach is either to stubborn or just plain blind to see that this offense is not going to work EVER...4th and 1 and in the shotgun,you might as well say 4 and 6
False. Tville was a power running team last year, and had much more success. They have always had athletes to man the skill positions, but that does not mean jack if your qb can't throw to his receivers in a spread offense. You're better off using multiple pullers and outnumbering the defense at the point of attack in a power running game when you don't have a good qb. Spread offense is suicide without a qb, as they have demonstrated all year.
I wouldn't say everything falls on the coaches. I noticed on Friday night there was some unsportsmanlike penalties thrown for 30 yards. That certainly does not fall on the coach. Players need to be disciplined enough to keep their emotions in check on the field and play ball.
And I believe most all of that falls squarely on the coaches...Allen brown teams were always very well disaplinded,except for maybe the last couple years,players most definitely need to be held accountable for their actions on and off the field
TVILLEDAWG2370, the only point I was trying to make is that the coaches can't go on the field and play for the players. I agree with you that players need to be disciplined both on and off the field.
Unsportsmanike penalties are a direct reflection of coaching, just like unruly kids in school are a direct reflection of parenting! Allen Brown has sent many a player back to the gym through the years. One year in the playoffs, playing AT North Rowan, 2 key starters got in a fight over socks in the locker room and coach Brown sent them all the way back to Thomasville. And one of them was the starting QB! We should never have able to compete with them that year but we still ended up winning the game!
At the end of his career, even Allen couldn't deal with all of the disciplinary issues on the team, because he didn't have the support of the administration. As I've said before, it all starts at the top. Hopefully, as soon as we get a superintendent, those things will begin to change. You have to do the right thing, even if it isn't always popular.
Who was the principal at Tville when they had most of their success with Alllen Brown and Benji Brown? Gurly?
That was the Brodie brothers that got sent back home before the playoff game at NR,NR was a great team that year,coming off a state championship game appearance against cumming the year before,I've seen brown get on many,many players over the years...I remember back in that 1993 season we lost to Randelman at randelman and after that game brown was really mad about something as he sat the team down after the game,I heard him say"I DONT CARE IF YOUR LAMONT PEGEUES OR MERCUS DOW YOU CAN GET OFF THIS TEAM RIGHT NOW" and both of those guys were our star players on offense and defense that year,nobody said a single word...dead silence
Thomasville City Schools lost a great superintendent a few years ago when Keith Tobin retired. I have known Keith for many years. He was my football coach and teacher many years ago when I went to East Davidson.
Yes they did lose a great one in Keith Tobin!
And I hear what you are saying oc but there is NO comparison with how Brown handled discipline compared to the current head coach. And I mean NO COMPARISON! No, he did not have the support of the administration his last few years but he still had more respect from the players than the coaches do right now and he still had his say even though he was being pushed out. There were discipline issues, but Brown just did not tolerate this mess -- even to his last day.
And I hear what you are saying oc but there is NO comparison with how Brown handled discipline compared to the current head coach. And I mean NO COMPARISON! No, he did not have the support of the administration his last few years but he still had more respect from the players than the coaches do right now and he still had his say even though he was being pushed out. There were discipline issues, but Brown just did not tolerate this mess -- even to his last day.
- Cannot clean house without open spots. Teachers/Coaches are not knocking the doors down to teach at THS. Cannot fire qualified teachers to clean house.
- Kids have to respond to whatever the system is and execute to win. So your telling me East Davidson, Trinity and other area schools (with much less athleticism) can run the spread but Tville can't?
- There are several long time veteran coaches on that staff, the kids are getting coached up.
- JV is on the rise, but the middle school numbers are real low and they are struggling.
- County schools are running some good talent thru and have excellent weight programs in place.
- Gone are the days of simply lining up and just out running East, Ledford, West, etc.
- Lastly, Its not over yet. Support the Dogs and the staff. Give it some time to cycle thru and then be a judge as to how the program is doing.
With the turnover Thomasville has, open spots aren't a problem. But I agree, cleaning house isn't the answer. But if you look at the number of volunteers less than six years removed from high school, there isn't as much veteran staff as one might think. Losing Bryant and Schweitzer hurt quite a bit.
Note the time it takes for the snap to reach the qb, and how inconsistent the line play is, and you'll see why there is little confidence in the spread this year among fans.
I am also hearing that the current staff runs a play once at practice and moves on to the next. No idea if that is true or not, but I know this: Coach Brown's famous words at practice every day were: "Run it again!!!!!!"
Repetition, fundamentals, load the defense with talent, do the best you can with what is left on offense with a good O ling and by running the ball and mixing in the pass, and stress the kicking game. That was Brown and that is what won 7 state titles, 331 games, and an almost 80% winning percentage. You know a coach or team that has done that then we will listen. Until then, let all these teams run the spread and be decent.
Repetition, fundamentals, load the defense with talent, do the best you can with what is left on offense with a good O ling and by running the ball and mixing in the pass, and stress the kicking game. That was Brown and that is what won 7 state titles, 331 games, and an almost 80% winning percentage. You know a coach or team that has done that then we will listen. Until then, let all these teams run the spread and be decent.
The spread is trendy. Offenses are like men's fashions, coaches are afraid to be out of date and get criticized. Personally I don't care if you run a single wing or t formation as long as you win.
If you look around many traditional powers have gone through are going through tough times and Thomasville is not immune. Look at Schools like Carver, Cummings, Hickory, Newton Connover, Parkland, Smith, Lexington ect ect ect. Sometimes talent levels drop and unless you are on that coaching staff and an insider you have no idea what is going on with the team. It is a players game now, coaches can provide direction and structure but now more than ever it is a players game. Example look at Ragsdale the past couple of years, did Tommy Norwood forget how to coach all of the sudden??? Or Southwestern Randolph did Coach Aikens who has rings forget how to coach???? Things go in cycles and Jimmies and Joes make the x's and o's work better
Seems to me that I recall hearing and reading that Thomasville had at least 50 applicants for the head coaching position so there's that.
The kids don't look like they're responding when all they do is mope around on the sideline.
The longest tenure coach is Herman and hes been there 8 years, the rest are 5 years or less, and I sure don't see no coaching during the game or at halftime!
The JV are on the rise but guess what, THEY RUN THE I FORMATION!
I don't know about the county schools talent except for a few schools so I wont comment on that.
The JV ran the I and did simply outrun East, West, and just about everyone else.
It is over, you simply cannot lose to East Davidson and remain a coach. If that happens then we lose all dignity.
What are you trying to say? Just some info for you and I am sure some of the other members on this forum will agree with me. East Davidson has a good coaching staff and they get the most out of their players night in and night out. Grant it Thomasville is not the same as in years past, but East has beaten them two out of the last three years. Vance Hanner has done a great job with the program at East Davidson and the kids are buying into his game plan. The group of talent he has at East now are the same kids that won a county championship several years ago.
Personally I just don't see how you have the varsity and jv run two different systems. Makes no sense for development purposes
The ragsdale coach is a proven winner,our coach is a proven loser,look at his numbers before he came to Thomasville and they thought he was the best coach for the job...yeah right!!!
i think personally they should have offered it to coach Bryant,and if he turned it down so be it
66, I agree with you. And you may remember that I picked East, missing the final score by one point. But frankly, losing to East without Shewcow is ridiculous. That was coaching, effort and discipline. One side had it, the other didn't. It wasn't talent. Thomasville wins that battle. Especially without East's best player.
Exactly. I live in the north Gaston/ East Lincoln area and have been to a lot of games at East Lincoln. Those kids look like they were born running the spread, even with no huddle and all play calls signaled in. But it's what they do at every level. I don't think there is a best or worst scheme. The key is to be good at what you do. If you have a JV running a power I and varsity running a spread...the offense will always underperform.
One of the great strengths of George Cushwa and Allen Brown was their ability to collaborate with little league and middle school coaches. There was a true effort to assist in the development of players from the very beginning. I remember my little league coaches watching film with Coach Cushwa. I learned in little league, not only the formations and defensive schemes, but the terminology of the varsity. A watered down version, but the basics were there. So, when I stepped onto the high school practice field as a sophomore, I wasn't intimidated by that big playbook. It was just an expansion of what I already had learned.
That same approach works today in well-run programs. With the instability of Thomasville for the last three years, it isn't being done. Some of these seniors have had three coaches in four years. Maybe more importantly, the turnover in assistants is hurting Thomasville. You don't easily replace two of the best assistant coaches in the state, especially when you've lost a coaching icon like Coach Brown.
Not denying that they have some talent but I personally believe Thomasville has more. East beat us those two years by playing good sound fundamental football, and barely beat us at that, even with our horrible coaching. East has the potential for a good squad I just think they are a little unproven still.
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