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Big South 3A/2A updates

sasha_nc

Well-Known Member
Dec 3, 2003
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Greensboro, NC
Weird night for the conference

South Point 14
Forestview 0

Stuart Cramer 28
North Gaston 0

Ashbrook 20
East Gaston 0

Lake Norman Charter 7
Hunter Huss 0
 
South Point 14 HALF
Forestview 0

Stuart Cramer 28 HALF
North Gaston 14

Ashbrook 20 HALF
East Gaston 0

Lake Norman Charter 14 HALF
Hunter Huss 0
 
Stuart Cramer 35 (10 min left in game)
North Gaston 21

North Gaston had pulled within 7 before the Storm scored another TD.

Lake Norman Charter 20 (5:20 left in game)
Hunter Huss 6

Ashbrook 20
East Gaston 13 (0:54 left in game)
 
Stuart Cramer 35
North Gaston 28 (7:40 left in game)

Lake Norman Charter 20 (FINAL)
Hunter Huss 6

Ashbrook 26 (0:38 left in game)
East Gaston 13
 
Pretty much everything that could go wrong, did go wrong for East Gaston in the first half. Fumbles on the first two series (first one on the first play of the game). A couple questionable calls in the first half (a 60 yard fumble return and score by EG that was called back on a phantom face mask penalty and then a strip and fumble recovery by Ashbrook as our QB was running into the end zone, looked to me like he was clearly in the end zone). We pretty much slept walked through the first half and dug a 20-0 hole we couldn't get out of. Our offense was very predicable all night! With all that happened we had a chance to win or tie the game with 2 mins to go in the game, but once again being predictable got us again (2 runs on 1st and 2nd down, then sacks on 3rd and 4th down). Just a bad bad night all around of the Warriors.
 
Pretty much everything that could go wrong, did go wrong for East Gaston in the first half. Fumbles on the first two series (first one on the first play of the game). A couple questionable calls in the first half (a 60 yard fumble return and score by EG that was called back on a phantom face mask penalty and then a strip and fumble recovery by Ashbrook as our QB was running into the end zone, looked to me like he was clearly in the end zone). We pretty much slept walked through the first half and dug a 20-0 hole we couldn't get out of. Our offense was very predicable all night! With all that happened we had a chance to win or tie the game with 2 mins to go in the game, but once again being predictable got us again (2 runs on 1st and 2nd down, then sacks on 3rd and 4th down). Just a bad bad night all around of the Warriors.

So sorry about the game. I hoped you guys would win but knew you had to get off to a good start. Unfortunately the team that played you was not the team that played us.
 
The results of tonight basically gift wrapped the conference title for SP barring some unbelievable circumstances the next three weeks. SP faces the easy part of their conference schedule and a 1 game cushion on the field. Raider, keep your foot on their throats the rest of the way. No time to let up now.
 
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The results of tonight basically gift wrapped the conference title for SP barring some unbelievable circumstances the next three weeks. SP faces the easy part of their conference schedule and a 1 game cushion on the field. Raider, keep your foot on their throats the rest of the way. No time to let up now.



+1000
 
It has been a crazy season. First North Gaston beat Ashbrook. Then Friday night's results really turned the conference topsy-turvy for some of the teams. With their wins, Stuart Cramer and LNC are likely to represent the 2A bracket in the playoffs while Huss goes on to basketball season.

Rank Team Overall Conference Games Remaining
1 South Point 6-2 4-0 LNC / NG / SC
2 Forestview 4-4 3-1 Ash / HH / EG
3 Ashbrook 4-4 2-2 FV / LNC / HH
4 Stuart Cramer 5-3 2-2 HH / EG / SP
5 East Gaston 4-4 2-2 NG / SC / FV
6 Lake Norman Charter 3-4 1-3 SP / Ash / NG
7 North Gaston 3-5 1-3 EG / SP / LNC
8 Hunter Huss 2-6 1-3 SC / FV / Ash

Even though Ashbrook, Cramer and East Gaston are all 2-2 in conference, I listed Ashbrook 3rd because they have beaten both SC and EG. I ranked 2A Stuart Cramer 4th because they have won 5 games compared to EG's 4. I ranked North Gaston 7th and Huss 8th, even though Huss beat NG, because NG had 3 wins to HH's 2. The playoff situation is still murky and anything could happen.

South Point must win at least two more games to guarantee the #1 automatic bid for 3A division (to stumble here would be a major embarrassment but strange things have happened this season). As for the automatic #2 spot in the 3A division, Ashbrook must win all remaining games to guarantee the #2 spot. Should Ashbrook beat Forestview but lose one of their other games, Forestview would have to win both remaining games to get the automatic bid. However, East Gaston could come up with the auto bid if the Warriors won all of their remaining games and Ashbrook beat Forestview and then Ashbrook lost to LNC or HH. (Take heart, Warriors, all is not lost yet.)

The NCHSAA has revised their rules to state that the 2nd team in a split conference must have a 34% overall winning percentage to clinch the automatic 2nd bid in the division. Cramer is the highest ranked 2A team in Big South and has clinched a playoff spot even if they lose the rest of their games. Lake Norman Charter must win at least one more game and Hunter Huss must win at least 2 games to qualify. It is possible that neither will meet that mark and only Cramer will go on to the playoffs.
 
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Sasha, nice analysis. A lot of meaningful game still to be played.

Thanks, RT. I don't know if Huss and North Gaston took their opponents lightly this week or if LNC and Cramer came prepared and are better than anticipated or just played above their heads. Whichever it was, their upcoming opponents need to be on the alert. This season is definitely "on any given night" one. Even our Raiders could get caught in a 'trap' game or two if they play sloppy.
 
If Sp loses any of these next 3 games they don't need to be in the playoffs.
Well, with their conference record they might deserve to be in the playoffs but they sure would not advance very far with a performance like that. But that is all moot because to paraphrase Keith Jackson, "SP will roll over them like the high tide over the flatlands!"
 
The NCHSAA has revised their rules to state that the 2nd team in a split conference must have a 34% overall winning percentage to clinch the automatic 2nd bid in the division. Cramer is the highest ranked 2A team in Big South and has clinched a playoff spot even if they lose the rest of their games. Lake Norman Charter must win at least one more game and Hunter Huss must win at least 2 games to qualify. It is possible that neither will meet that mark and only Cramer will go on to the playoffs.

While replying to a post of the 2A boards regarding playoff picture, I realized that the 2A standings are an absolute mess and that I had missed a couple of scenarios that could turn that division upside down. Those two wild, but possible, scenarios could end up with the Storm having the better overall record but as the #2 or #3 seed. :eek: Get ready for some major confusion and head scratching.

Based on current standings and remaining games (see below), LKN Charter would need to win at least one more game and Hunter Huss would need to either beat Stuart Cramer or get two more wins to be eligible for playoffs.

Team Overall Conference Games Remaining
Stuart Cramer 5-3 2-2 HH / EG / SP
Lake Norman Charter 3-4 1-3 SP / Ash / NG
Hunter Huss 2-6 1-3 SC / FV / Ash

Hunter Huss must get the win over Stuart Cramer. Under this scenario (#1), if the Huskies, Storm and Knights go winless for the remainder of the season, Huss would be the 2A #1 by virtue of their win over the Storm who would be the #2 and despite having the worse record overall (3-8; 3-7; 2-5). o_O Should HH lose to SC, they probably will be out of the playoffs as victories against Forestview and Ashbrook are unlikely. Even though the Ashbrook game is a big rivalry and can yield unpredictable results, that win alone would not be enough.

Stuart Cramer can sew up the #1 2A slot with a win over Huss this Friday but this game is a toss up. While the Storm could upset East Gaston, that is unlikely. Unless South Point fails to show up for the game, Cramer won't get the W. Without another win, Cramer will finish 5-6 overall, 5-5 for playoff purposes, and 2-5 conference.

Lake Norman Charter is almost certain to get a big L against the Red Raiders and probably the Green Wave (although this depends on which Ashbrook team plays - Jekyll (A win) or Hyde (LKN win). The match up with North Gaston is a toss up. By the time these two teams meet, both will have been mauled by the South Point defense. If the Knights fail to defeat the Wildcats, they will not qualify for the playoffs.

There is a scenario (#2) where determining the 2A #1 could be difficult and involves a possible 3-way tie:
  • If Huss beats Cramer, loses to Forestview and Ashbrook > 3-8; 3-7; 2-5
  • AND Cramer loses to Huss, East Gaston, and South Point > 5-6; 5-5; 2-5
  • AND LKN Charter beats North Gaston, and loses to South Point and Ashbrook > 4-6; 4-6; 2-5

Huss defeats Cramer who defeated LKN Charter who in turn defeated Huss. This would probably require a drawing be done the last week of the regular season before the final games are played.

:confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:
 
They are 2A, nobody really cares. They are only in our conference to fill out a Gaston County conference which also serves the dual purpose of keeping out worthy teams like Crest and Kings Mountain. They serve as fluffer games to pad the winning record (for the decent 3A teams) but do nothing to help SP prepare for the playoffs. No matter which of the little red hair step sisters make the playoffs, Lincolnton, East Lincoln, and Shelby will destroy them.
 
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They are 2A, nobody really cares. They are only in our conference to fill out a Gaston County conference which also serves the dual purpose of keeping out worthy teams like Crest and Kings Mountain. They serve as fluffer games to pad the winning record (for the decent 3A teams) but do nothing to help SP prepare for the playoffs. No matter which of the little red hair step sisters make the playoffs, Lincolnton, East Lincoln, and Shelby will destroy them.

Yeah no reason why Crest, Kings Mountain AND Burns shouldn't have been in the Big South instead of Hunter Huss, Cramer and Lake Norman Charter. Hopefully this becomes reality in 2017.
 
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Yeah no reason why Crest, Kings Mountain AND Burns shouldn't have been in the Big South instead of Hunter Huss, Cramer and Lake Norman Charter. Hopefully this becomes reality in 2017.

Sorry Bulldog, I did not mean to leave you out. Exactly right, Burns should be in the conference too. Maybe Winn Dixie Charter School on New Hope Road can start a team and they can all go off together and have a big ole time in their own midget conference.

But, before Burns is allowed back into the conference they have to sign a contract agreeing to keep their goats out of their stadium! ;)
 
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Fair enough, hopefully we will have it together by 2017.

Sorry Bulldog, I did not mean to leave you out. Exactly right, Burns should be in the conference too. Maybe Winn Dixie Charter School on New Hope Road can start a team and they can all go off together and have a big ole time in their own midget conference.

But, before Burns is allowed back into the conference they have to sign a contract agreeing to keep their goats out of their stadium! ;)
 
Huss had the good fortune to fall to 2A size at the time of realignment. But last year, had bigger numbers than several 3A schools. And isn't Cramer eventually going to become a 3A school?
 
Huss had the good fortune to fall to 2A size at the time of realignment. But last year, had bigger numbers than several 3A schools. And isn't Cramer eventually going to become a 3A school?
yes, both Huss and Cramer will likely be 3A at the next alignment
 
Huss and Cramerton will be 3A and Ashbrook will be probly be 4A

Ashbrook will probably remain as a large 3A based on the 20-30-30-20 alignment approved by the NCHSAA. It looks like schools (above 1600 will be 4A and below 700 as 1A 75 schools in each), with the break between 3A and 2A (approx.112 schools in each) around 1050 - based on 2014 numbers. What the Big South looks like in 2017 depends on what Stuart Cramer's 2015 ADMs come in as whether they stay as 2A or go up to 3A. Either way, I am not sure much would change in the Big South.
 
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Cramer going 3A would probably keep us out of the Big South, and maybe Crest and KM too. A 9-team conference consisting of Ashbrook, Forestview, East Gaston, North Gaston, South Point, Hunter Huss, Crest, Burns and KM has been suggested already, add Cramer and that would be 10 teams and I doubt a conference that size will be allowed at the beginning of a realignment period.
 
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Just make two conferences out of them. Call them the Big South and the Big South Wannabes. The strongest 5 are in the Big South. At realignment time, if there is a change in power, move the weakest Big South members back to the Wannabes and promote the best Wannabes up the ladder to the Big South. Just like farm team players in baseball.
 
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Cramer going 3A would probably keep us out of the Big South, and maybe Crest and KM too. A 9-team conference consisting of Ashbrook, Forestview, East Gaston, North Gaston, South Point, Hunter Huss, Crest, Burns and KM has been suggested already, add Cramer and that would be 10 teams and I doubt a conference that size will be allowed at the beginning of a realignment period.

Can't see why they can't. The South Piedmont conference (Concord, West Rowan) currently has 10 teams. It would reduce pre-conference games down to 2. However,Crest, Kings Mountain, Burns and South Point would probably have to alternate the years when they play Shelby - maybe one year Crest and Burns and then Kings Mountain and South Point. Big South teams not playing Shelby could set up a rotation with another team like Lincolnton or Asheville.
 
It could work like you said except that Crest would never give up playing Shelby each year (nor should they). That would be like State and Carolina not playing each other every year in football or Carolina and Duke in basketball. That will never happen. (Or SP & EG except that we have won that game so much the shine is kinda worn off that rivalry. If EG starts winning again the rivalry will pick back up.)
 
Yeah Crest and Shelby will not alternate, whether one team is way down or not. Crest and SP have built a rivalry too, we won't give that game up easily. SO, it would have to be Crest and Shelby as one game, and everyone else alternate with Shelby, or find another team to play regularly...I keep saying we should go down south more anyway, or pick up a few private schools in charlotte. Maybe even the 4AA boys could finally workout. I wouldn't mind having East L-town or just L-town on the schedule, anything is better than TCR. ACR and Asheville are apparently too hard to schedule. Or it's too much to travel, I will never say freedom, mostly because after Emmons is gone, they will be more irrelevant than they already are. I want Byrnes, Gaffney, and Dorman...but it's not up to me, I know the coaches are doing their best, but they are losing so much money with TCR...There has to be someone better.
 
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I would think Byrnes, Gaffney or Dorman would be natural fits for Crest south of the border. Would be great games for sure. I would like to see SP schedule York and their magnificent new stadium/campus along with Clover again. Those would be big games also.

I love the fact Crest and Shelby are back on SP's schedule every year. Would not want to give either of those up.
 
Not surprisingly, no threads have been started so I decided to tag on to this one. Anyone have any thoughts on what could be close conference games this week (10/23)? Here are mine.

Ashbrook vs Forestview
These two teams are battling for the #2 playoff spot. Whoever wins this game is probably it unless the winner loses their remaining game. Ashbrook surprised me last week after the way they play at South Point the week before. If the Green Wave focus on more of a running game (likely given they no longer have their two star WRs), then the Jaguars could struggle on the defensive end. If Forestview can rebound from last week's loss and get on the boards early and often, they could pull this one out. Forestview by 1.

East Gaston vs North Gaston
East Gaston really needs this win to get a playoff berth, especially since the next two weeks could be equally tough. The Warriors have not had much luck against running games in the conference which favors North Gaston. However, the Wildcats must be getting some Ashbrook students because they have lost some games they should have won (Huss and Cramer) and won over Ashbrook. Turnovers plagued both teams last week so whoever wins that battle will win the game. I am going with EG over NG but won't be surprised if this goes the other way as the NG needs a win this week and against LKN. East Gaston by 3

Hunter Huss vs Stuart Cramer
Yes, I know that it's 2A but both teams are in our conference and likely to be 3A in 2017. Whichever team wins will get the #1 seed in the division . However, Huss needs a win in this game AND a win over Ashbrook to get in the playoffs (to meet the 34% requirement). Cramer has enough to get in but winning the division would be a bonus to them. Cramer by 2
 
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