3 way tie scenerio.

[KW23]

I know this most likely won't happen. But what if.

1.Robbinsville beats Swain and then loses to Hayesville.
2. Cherokee beats Swain
3. Murphy loses to Andrews

Makes 3 way tie for 1st all will have 2 conference losses. Who gets the 1 seed. I imagine it would be whomever has the highest rpi?

 

[BK13T-$]

Normally they draw.

 

[Fynsportscaleb]

1. Robbinsville loses to Swain
2. Murphy loses to Andrews
3. Robbinsville Beats Hayesville
4. Cherokee beats swain

I believe that would put us at a 4 way tie right?

 

[KW23]

Yes that would be 4 way tie...but games between the teams.....Cherokee would be 2 and 1....Murphy would be 2 and 1....Robbinsville would be 1 and 2.....and Swain would be 1 and 2. Therefore it would be between cherokee and murphy and murphy beat cherokee....so murphy would get the 1 seed.

I understand breaking that 4 way tie. But how do u break a 3 way tie when everyone beat the other team. And the teams are 1 and 1 in games vs each other.

 

[mhs95]

Yes that would be 4 way tie...but games between the teams.....Cherokee would be 2 and 1....Murphy would be 2 and 1....Robbinsville would be 1 and 2.....and Swain would be 1 and 2. Therefore it would be between cherokee and murphy and murphy beat cherokee....so murphy would get the 1 seed.

I understand breaking that 4 way tie. But how do u break a 3 way tie when everyone beat the other team. And the teams are 1 and 1 in games vs each other.

When it happened in '17 the head coaches got together after the games Friday night and drew straws.

 

[Deana_King]

No draws - rpi will be used

 

[Old Mountaineer]

I know this most likely won't happen. But what if.

1.Robbinsville beats Swain and then loses to Hayesville.
2. Cherokee beats Swain
3. Murphy loses to Andrews

Makes 3 way tie for 1st all will have 2 conference losses. Who gets the 1 seed. I imagine it would be whomever has the highest rpi?

Ex. 2: Teams A, B and C are tied for fourth in the conference standings with identical records.
In games among the three, A was 3-1, B was 2-2 and C was 1-3. The tie is broken; A is
fourth, B is fifth and C sixth.
(3) Any time throughout the whole procedure that a multiple tie is
reduced to two teams, no
matter what criteria is being used, use head-to-head conference competition between those
remaining if possible.

 

[BK13T-$]

So is it head to head in a two way tie for confrence or rpi.

 

[SitOut]

So is it head to head in a two way tie for confrence or rpi.

Head to head for 2-way tie, rpi if it’s 3 or more…

 

[Pantherdad13]

Head to head for 2-way tie, rpi if it’s 3 or more…

not true, if any tie rpi will be used.

 

[SitOut]

not true, if any tie rpi will be used.

So if both Robbinsville and Murphy win out, Murphy could be champ because of higher rpi?

 

[BK13T-$]

Wow the state continues to out do it's self.

 

[BK13T-$]

I don't think that's true. The state usually only seeds for playoffs. The confrences handle the confrence.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

Read the rule for conference placement it doesn't say anything about draw or RPI but head to head records. Now the last part ..
" use head-to-head conference competition between those
remaining if possible."
The "if possible" part I'd assume means that a conference can go to something else like RPI or drawing if you can't get an clear winner with head to head but most of the time it will work.

 

[Griddie]

Have to think it will be 1. Robbinsville 2. Murphy 3. Swain

 

[Gentle Knight]

So if both Robbinsville and Murphy win out, Murphy could be champ because of higher rpi?

No ,conference Champs are seeded 1st ,then rpi..Rpi has nothing to do with conference champs.If Robbinsville and Murphy win out,Robbinsville is conference champs.

 

[Pantherdad13]

No ,conference Champs are seeded 1st ,then rpi..Rpi has nothing to do with conference champs.If Robbinsville and Murphy win out,Robbinsville is conference champs.

I just don’t think this is true this year. Ask deana.

 

[Griddie]

There is no scenario where Robbinsville and Murphy finished tied and the Black Knights don’t get the No. 1 seed after beating Murphy head to head. If that happens we just need to disband NCHSAA football.

 

[Gentle Knight]

I just don’t think this is true this year. Ask deana.

Rpi will only determine conference Champs if there is a tie to my understanding

 

[Old Mountaineer]

I'll try this one more time, here is the entire rule on breaking ties in conferences..no where in it will you see "RPI" but what you will see "head to head" it meations 2 teams then examples if 4 tied teams and if 3 tied teams.

North Carolina High School
Athletic Association
HANDBOOK
2021-2022 EDITION

4.1.12 Tiebreaking Procedure: All parts of this procedure are mandatory. The steps should be followed in the or-
der as they appear in the procedure.
(a) Determining Conference Standings: These rules apply for determining the final regular season
standings in any sport in which a conference awards its conference championship on the basis of
regular season competition.
(1) The conference standings shall be determined on the basis of the percentage of conference
games won by each team at the end of the regular season, based on conference regulations
and subject to the tiebreaking procedure which follows. The team finishing in first place
shall be recognized as the conference champion; if a tie exists for first place, then conference
co-champions, tri-champions, etc., shall be declared.
(2) If two or more teams have equal conference percentages at the end of the season, the team
that has the edge in "head-to-head" competition will get the higher place in the standings. All
conference games played against each other would count in the head-to-head competition.
The intent is to break the tie by using the tied teams.
Ex. 1: If there is a four-way tie for first and Team A and Team B are 2-1 while Team C and
Team D are 1-2, in games among the four of them, A and B would be tied for first by
virtue of their 2-1, with C and D tied for third. Then look at "head-to-head" between the
two (A and B) to break that tie, and then between the other two (C and D) to break
that remaining tie.
Ex. 2: Teams A, B and C are tied for fourth in the conference standings with identical records.
In games among the three, A was 3-1, B was 2-2 and C was 1-3. The tie is broken; A is
fourth, B is fifth and C sixth.
(3) Any time throughout the whole procedure that a multiple tie is reduced to two teams, no matter what criteria is being used, use "head-to-head" conference competition between those
remaining if possible.

 

[KW23]

U keep posting that over and over...but Ex. 2; don't say s**t about if team A is 1-1, B is 1-1, and C is 1-1. That's what I'm asking if conference record is identical In a 3 way tie.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

U keep posting that over and over...but Ex. 2; don't say s**t about if team A is 1-1, B is 1-1, and C is 1-1. That's what I'm asking if conference record is identical In a 3 way tie.

Well people keeping saying at least it read like the RPI from the get go made the determination breaking any tie. But I get what your saying sorry about that, like it a 6 team conference if A B & C are all 4-1 in the conference and it can't be decided by head to head because A beat B and B beat C and C beat A . I did post the second one just the part at the end..
use head-to-head conference competition between those remaining if possible. So yeah in that you're in the "if possible" and it becomes impossible then just under it there's a section on tournament seeding which talks about a tie that can't be broken and does say drawing so that's probably what they'd do like in times pass.

 

[KW23]

Wasn't trying to be a jerk just kept seeing that posted over and over and it didn't answer the question. Deana said above it would be broken by rpi. So Id trust that answer.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

Wasn't trying to be a jerk just kept seeing that posted over and over and it didn't answer the question. Deana said above it would be broken by rpi. So Id trust that answer.

No worries you wasn't being a jerk I was just responding to seeing RPI over again.
No disrespect to Deana and she may well found or heard some information that I haven't seen but in the rule book I can't find anywhere that RPI is used for tie breakers only for playoff seeding purposes and if someone can't show where it does great I'm certainly capable of missing it.
But as far as the original scenario the 3 team Murphy, Swain and Robbinsville I believe if Swain loses to Cherokee and Robbinsville then they'll be 2-3 while Murphy and Robbinsville would be 3-2 with Robbinsville winning in the head to head but if Swain beat Cherokee they'd also be 3-2 but they would have lost to both Murphy and Robbinsville who would still be the champion .

 

[Old Mountaineer]

No worries you wasn't being a jerk I was just responding to seeing RPI over again.
No disrespect to Deana and she may well found or heard some information that I haven't seen but in the rule book I can't find anywhere that RPI is used for tie breakers only for playoff seeding purposes and if someone can't show where it does great I'm certainly capable of missing it.
But as far as the original scenario the 3 team Murphy, Swain and Robbinsville I believe if Swain loses to Cherokee and Robbinsville then they'll be 2-3 while Murphy and Robbinsville would be 3-2 with Robbinsville winning in the head to head but if Swain beat Cherokee they'd also be 3-2 but they would have lost to both Murphy and Robbinsville who would still be the champion .

Well like I said I'm capable of missing it so went back to look it the section below the one I posted under Determining NCHSAA Playoff Representatives: actually I typed in the search bar RPI and found it should have done that in the first place so my apologies. Now the RPI still isn't the first criteria for breaking a tie it is head to head but in the case were the tie can't be broken using head to head then the RPI will be use but if they somehow have the same RPI then they draw.

"If the tie is still not broken after step 6, it will be broken using the NCHSAA RPI Rating.
(8) If the tie still exists, a draw will be held by the tied teams for the seeds available. All tied teams
for a position will draw with the numbers of the spots for which they are tied in a hat."

 

[KW23]

Good work. Rpi it is...no way 3 way tie with all identical rpi's lol

 

[Gentle Knight]

No worries you wasn't being a jerk I was just responding to seeing RPI over again.
No disrespect to Deana and she may well found or heard some information that I haven't seen but in the rule book I can't find anywhere that RPI is used for tie breakers only for playoff seeding purposes and if someone can't show where it does great I'm certainly capable of missing it.
But as far as the original scenario the 3 team Murphy, Swain and Robbinsville I believe if Swain loses to Cherokee and Robbinsville then they'll be 2-3 while Murphy and Robbinsville would be 3-2 with Robbinsville winning in the head to head but if Swain beat Cherokee they'd also be 3-2 but they would have lost to both Murphy and Robbinsville who would still be the champion .

Did I miss something? How will Robbinsville be 3-2?

 

[No Mercy]

If the tied teams each have identical records amongst them head to head, rpi will be used. However, head to head will be used first.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

If the tied teams each have identical records amongst them head to head, rpi will be used. However, head to head will be used first.

Right if head to head can't break the tie then RPI and if their RPI is indentical so can't break the tie then drawing out of the hat is use.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

Did I miss something? How will Robbinsville be 3-2?

Well they're 2-1 in the conference right now right? So under the scenarion that started this thread he has Robbinsville beating Swain ...3-1 then losing to Hayesville..3-2

 

[KW23]

I was just seeing if there was anyway cherokee could get 1 seed. But even if that miracle scenerio happens which I know it won't Murphy's rpi would be higher so cherokee blew it by losing to Hayesville Friday. Hayesville looked for real...at least on offense...maybe they could upset someone in the playoffs.

 

[Old Mountaineer]

I was just seeing if there was anyway cherokee could get 1 seed. But even if that miracle scenerio happens which I know it won't Murphy's rpi would be higher so cherokee blew it by losing to Hayesville Friday. Hayesville looked for real...at least on offense...maybe they could upset someone in the playoffs.

Yeah right now the best they can do is second place in a couple of scenarios the craziest being......
If Cherokee beats Swain they're 3-2
If Robbinsville loses to Swain then they beat Hayesville they're 3-2
If Swain beats Robbinsville loses to Cherokee they're 3-2
If Murphy loses to Andrews they're 3-2
4 way tie @ 3-2 then.......
Murphy beat Cherokee & Swain ..2 wins
Robbinsville beat Murphy...1win
Swain beat Robbinsville...1 win
Cherokee beat Robbinsville & Swain 2 wins.
Murphy beat Cherokee so Murphy is conference champions , Cherokee is second place.

As far as conference champions
Robbinsville wins both games at 4-1 they are conference champions. No matter what happens in any other game.

If 2-1 Swain beats Robbinsville and Cherokee making them 4-1 and Andrews beats Murphy then Swain is champion.

Murphy beats Andrews then they're 4-1 in the conference so if Robbinsville loses ether game then Murphy is champion.

If Cherokee beats Swain, Andrews beats Murphy, Hayesville beats Robbinsville then 3 way tie between Cherokee, Robbinsville and Murphy.... Cherokee beat Robbinsville, Robbinsville beat Murphy and Murphy beat Cherokee so head to head doesn't break the tie so it will go RPI.