RIP to the NCHSAA??

[Sportsnut17]

From the Greensboro Record, Que Tucker’s take

NCHSAA commissioner says race and gender played a role in legislation to dissolve the association

Que Tucker says she doesn't see a path to a compromise after the N.C. Senate Education unanimously approves HB 91. "We’ve always wanted to work with the General Assembly. ...

greensboro.com

 

[bigdadd11103]

Its definitely political and Que is 100% correct. If she were a white male they wouldn't be trying to do this to the association. The association should be applauded for being able to make tough decisions, have a budget, and have forethought. The state legislature has made this personal instead of looking at it as a whole. They will open up an unattended can of worms that may destroy NC public school athletics. Not sure the legislature understands the ends and outs of the behind the scenes stuff the NCHSAA deals with.

Its a you got money, give it to the schools without looking at how the endowment is broken down. Punhsing them for being successful.

 

[Mbulld]

Anybody that was at Glenn hs for the wrestling state championship can shed some light on how well the nchsaa can operate

 

[ocdavis31]

The Board of Directors in place now is the same people plus a few non school affiliated members such as one from DPI and one that represents school boards.

btango, am I correct in saying that the current board of directors are elected from among its membership?

If so, how is a board chosen by politicians of either party better? Are we naive enough to think party politics won’t play into the selections?

 

[btango]

btango, am I correct in saying that the current board of directors are elected from among its membership?

If so, how is a board chosen by politicians of either party better? Are we naive enough to think party politics won’t play into the selections?

My understanding they are nominated by the district to the position.

I am not in favor and think there has been a lot of grandstanding in the meetings especially by McInnis and now the Union County rep Johnson and the female (I think from Iredell). They are not presenting the facts as much as they are doing a sales job.

 

[btango]

Its definitely political and Que is 100% correct. If she were a white male they wouldn't be trying to do this to the association. The association should be applauded for being able to make tough decisions, have a budget, and have forethought. The state legislature has made this personal instead of looking at it as a whole. They will open up an unattended can of worms that may destroy NC public school athletics. Not sure the legislature understands the ends and outs of the behind the scenes stuff the NCHSAA deals with.

Its a you got money, give it to the schools without looking at how the endowment is broken down. Punhsing them for being successful.

I think this is more to do with McInnis was told Anson would not be reinstated to the playoffs and he got mad he did not get his way. From there it grew. This has been ongoing with other reps over the years but seems to have came to a head now. McInnis started on schools being removed from the playoffs as punishment and then heard about the fine which led to more research into that which was where did the fines go. I think it became personable because he did not get his way but this has been simmering for a long time.

I will say this, no one would have challenged Charlie Adams as he had the connections at the highest levels to derail this plus he had been a state employee and it was "under" UNC during his time. I think Davis Whitfield, the director between Que and Charlie, would have received the same treatment but he would have been much more accommodating to them which from what I am hearing is a big part of this.

 

[tdl6242]

From the Greensboro Record, Que Tucker’s take

NCHSAA commissioner says race and gender played a role in legislation to dissolve the association

Que Tucker says she doesn't see a path to a compromise after the N.C. Senate Education unanimously approves HB 91. "We’ve always wanted to work with the General Assembly. ...

greensboro.com

I disagree...... The NCHSAA has run this same playbook of ineptitude for the last 20 years. Que Tucker learned from her predecessors and never made any changes or adjustments to said playbook she even inflicted some of the most hurtful punishments to schools documented in the last 12 years. She took the helm and her first order was steady as she goes......needless to say the Iceberg was in the distance and did not care who was at the helm and was ready to sink the ship. Now before folks come at me please in detail document any new strategic or structural ideas that she has brought forward? Coaches are on this site have you seen anything except the status quo? If I am wrong I welcome the dialogue....

 

[bigdadd11103]

TDL, again its personal. Most of the people making the fuss had teams that were eliminated from the playoffs. MC lost 9 wins because of it and a spot in the playoffs. If your team was not involved then this wouldn't be such a passionate issue. We have to have rules and consequences for the rules.

-NO one wants to talk about the underbelly of recruiting, players switching schools, false addresses, and these type of things that happen in metropolitan areas of NC. The rules are set to allow for fair play and no ambiguity in situations. If you allow politics and ambiguity to be involved you are going to have a BIG mess. Let schools not get penalized for breaking rules and the haves/have nots will be even greater.

-Lastly with players skipping senior seasons, and NIL becoming a big topic the last thing I want to see is no NCHSAA.

 

[CPC4LIFE]

As long as Que Tucker is removed from her position, I’m all good with whatever they do. North Carolina should have played football last fall. She has been bad for many years going back to Televised LIVE Games that took forever to refusing ESPN offers to televise games. She has done a poor job. North Carolina deserves better. Step down Que!

 

[bigdadd11103]

As long as Que Tucker is removed from her position, I’m all good with whatever they do. North Carolina should have played football last fall. She has been bad for many years going back to Televised LIVE Games that took forever to refusing ESPN offers to televise games. She has done a poor job. North Carolina deserves better. Step down Que!

Did you ask for Charlie Adams or Davis Whitfield to step down? Just curious.......They held the same stance on TV games.

NC Played football in the Spring with fans and all games were available live for basketball and football. So she should have allowed play with no fans, gone against state law, or just said F it, I'll just put the children at risk and do what I want to appease football fans?

-Lets see. VA, CA, NY, IL cancelled their fall seasons, SC reduced season, capacity, and reduced playoffs. Lets see we had a very successful spring season with fans, and are already working out preparing for the fall season. Lets see most metropolitan areas sans FL and Texas cancelled the fall seasons.

-Funny how she holds same positions as her predecessors but now its an issue?

 

[tdl6242]

TDL, again its personal. Most of the people making the fuss had teams that were eliminated from the playoffs. MC lost 9 wins because of it and a spot in the playoffs. If your team was not involved then this wouldn't be such a passionate issue. We have to have rules and consequences for the rules.

-NO one wants to talk about the underbelly of recruiting, players switching schools, false addresses, and these type of things that happen in metropolitan areas of NC. The rules are set to allow for fair play and no ambiguity in situations. If you allow politics and ambiguity to be involved you are going to have a BIG mess. Let schools not get penalized for breaking rules and the haves/have nots will be even greater.

-Lastly with players skipping senior seasons, and NIL becoming a big topic the last thing I want to see is no

My comments have zero to do with a specific team or incident the NCHSAA rules are rules but the NCHSAA has been political and ambiguous for decades. I am speaking from a more strategic standpoint. The culture of dictatorial management when it comes to the changing nature of HS Athletics has been the downfall. Just as an example going way back to when TK and Indy had a chance to get a paid sponsorship from NIKE during the 7 year run and CMS under the oversite of NCHSAA could not and did not see that this was the inflection point of what NIL is growing to be. The Myers Park Volleyball Team not being permitted to travel to an outside Tourney out of season to play, get paid & get National exposure for CMS and Charlotte NC. As stated above the slow reaction to Streaming and rev generation for schools and these are just a few of many. Sports are trickle down from a policies and structure standpoint its not hard to just look at the College game and know that as things get passed or forced by legal challenges at that level that they will trickle down to the HS level. The problem with the NCHSAA is that they are a Big Box shopping mall who fight and refuse to change there way of doing business protecting there aged and worn bricks and mortar and they have now looked up and Amazon is standing right in front of them poised and ready to take there business. Let me be clear I think there needs to be a meeting in the middle but you have to change the leadership to enable some of the generals who might have ideas but have been afraid to share them based on the culture....

 

[btango]

Don't think you would see much improvement with being more adaptable if the legislature takes over. Think it may be worse and even more bureaucratic.

 

[tdl6242]

Don't think you would see much improvement with being more adaptable if the legislature takes over. Think it may be worse and even more bureaucratic.

Agree it would be the other extreme......we see what happens in real life when extreme factions command power. There needs to be a middle ground with a structure that enables oversite by both sides that gives the "middle" thinkers a place to impose some sanity into the process...

 

[Wmhs1992]

This is opinion only.
So as I see it the main concern is over fines, infractions, gate receipts for playoff games and appeals process. Some things that could be looked at. I have read the 14 page bill now that it is correctly posted. Not much changes in administration other than politicians get to appoint this commission. It is still coaches, ADs and Superintendents of school systems. I don't like the appointment issue. Member schools do not have a direct vote in who is representing them. That is problem #1.
Anytime we allow politics into anything it seems to go south.
So let's eliminate the fines and go to a demerit system. This commission will come up with that policy. I am ok with that, but the legislation states that this system will be used to Adopt a system of demerits for infractions of student participation rules and . gameplay rules which may result in reprimands, probations, suspensions, forfeitures of contests, forfeitures of titles, and disqualifications. (This is straight from the bill.) So is Senator McInnis who has a hand in appointing said commission when the schools of his district come under fire again, is he going to amend the law so that the demerit system is more lenient, or ask the commission to do so . That is what politicians do when things are not favorable for them. This is problem #2.
So now we go to the gate receipt issues. The legislation states this: This Commission can retain up to fifty percent (50%) of the net proceeds of any State tournament game. (This again is straight form the legislation) The point I am trying to make is this, according the spring meeting notes of the NCHSSA it lowered the schools portion in some sports. I know the response to this will be well if the legislature wouldn't have looked at it they wouldn't have done that. The 50% is still higher than what the NCHSSA takes per playoff game. This leaves a lot of room for speculation and more rules as to who pays 50% and who pays 15%. Is this fair and equitable? I am not sure as they have not laid out the rules.
I would urge you to read the bill these are just two things that deal with Senator McInnis's concerns as he as stated. There is still gong to be a fee for member schools a sliding scale based on classification as I read it. So based on the revenue form year to year this may change. Not sure how the NCHSAA does this so I am not saying good one way or the other on this.
I think that that the NCHSAA has done a good job. The two parties involved here need to sit down and come to some common ground on some things. If things go south quick, the student-athletes will be the ones to suffer. Not only the athletes but coaches, AD's and school systems.

 

[btango]

It this carries on much longer I can assure you that the people working in the office will need to make a decision as to what is better for their family and is that to hope this works out and they retain their job with the same income and benefits or they take another job. If the legislature goes through with what I heard then the NCHSAA will be down to a handful of employees fairly soon and every student athlete will feel that burden this year and next when the legislature has their first year.

Remember, in the hearing it was said there would two administrative people and the boards would run the entity. People with full time jobs will take on and administer the day to day plus their current commitments. I DON'T THINK SO.

 

[ncball04]

Que Tucker has been a waste of a leader in the NCHSAA from the time she took over. I personally am happy that this is happening to her.

 

[bigdadd11103]

It this carries on much longer I can assure you that the people working in the office will need to make a decision as to what is better for their family and is that to hope this works out and they retain their job with the same income and benefits or they take another job. If the legislature goes through with what I heard then the NCHSAA will be down to a handful of employees fairly soon and every student athlete will feel that burden this year and next when the legislature has their first year.

Remember, in the hearing it was said there would two administrative people and the boards would run the entity. People with full time jobs will take on and administer the day to day plus their current commitments. I DON'T THINK SO.

Correct. Dont really think they know what they are getting into. They are letting emotions, politics and closeted racism feed them right now. It really doesn't make sense. You make minor adjustments to great running organization, and review penalty process. You don't let butt hurt politicians set up a new system with political bias.

Its like they are jealous the NCHSAA is successful in what it does and has a surplus from good money management. If Que Tucker was a white man this would not even be remotely happening. They see an opportunity to try and remove her and are pouncing.

 

[bigdadd11103]

Que Tucker has been a waste of a leader in the NCHSAA from the time she took over. I personally am happy that this is happening to her.

Hmmm. Did you call for Charlie Adams and Davis Whitfield's job? Just asking because she holds the exact same policies they did. Were they waste of leaders? The closeted racist are out in full force. State what policy you dislike. what mistake she made in your opinion. State how she changed things differently than her predecessors. State facts, not personal hate.

 

[nepsy7]

Hmmm. Did you call for Charlie Adams and Davis Whitfield's job? Just asking because she holds the exact same policies they did. Were they waste of leaders? The closeted racist are out in full force. State what policy you dislike. what mistake she made in your opinion. State how she changed things differently than her predecessors. State facts, not personal hate.

My sentiments exactly. The part were he said, from the time she took over. What changes did she make, that were different from her predecessor’s?

 

[S2V2]

My sentiments exactly. The part were he said, from the time she took over. What changes did she make, that were different from her predecessor’s?

She made recommendations for social distancing guidelines.

 

[CatholicCougs14]

Hmmm. Did you call for Charlie Adams and Davis Whitfield's job? Just asking because she holds the exact same policies they did. Were they waste of leaders? The closeted racist are out in full force. State what policy you dislike. what mistake she made in your opinion. State how she changed things differently than her predecessors. State facts, not personal hate.

This. All of this. I’ve thought the same thing. She has done the exact same things that Adams and Whitfield did, yet she’s so hated.

 

[bigdadd11103]

This. All of this. I’ve thought the same thing. She has done the exact same things that Adams and Whitfield did, yet she’s so hated.

Just call it like I see it. Bottom line folks were mad that there was no high school football in NC in the fall and the limited playoff spots. Bottom line they knew the rules before the spring season. All we heard was they need to play, comradery, teammates losing senior season. ETC ETC. Then a great majority of high profile guys didn't even care to play. They played successfully. IMHO if ESPN hadn't started showing high school games early, and college football hadn't started this wouldn't be an issue as all seasons would have cancelled. AT one point the BIG 10, PAC, and ACC were not going to play, but reversed course when the SEC said yes they were playing. So common sense took over and we adjusted but folks are still mad.

Roy put in mandates that limited athletics and other entities during a period of uncertainty. Was I mad at no football in the fall? Hell yeah I was mad. My son team cancelled season and other leagues were playing. Our state cancelled and others playing. Made no sense to me. Then the COVID deaths' started reaching home and my opinion changed. Id love to see a poll on COVID opinion based on ones that it effected and those it didn't. Just glad we are getting back on the field and players are getting opportunity to ball!

 

[Muchadoaboutnothin]

This. All of this. I’ve thought the same thing. She has done the exact same things that Adams and Whitfield did, yet she’s so hated.

Taking race and gender out of the equation. (realizing that is easier said than done) Doing the same thing for the last 40 years is not necessarily a good thing. Times are changing. The game, society, economic needs, perception of the game, popularity of the game, and so many other factors, that the excuse of this is how its always been done doesn't hold water. I by no means have the answers to how to "fix it" but, a little over sight can not hurt. Absolute power, absolutely corrupts no matter who is wielding the scepter.....

 

[CatholicCougs14]

Taking race and gender out of the equation. (realizing that is easier said than done) Doing the same thing for the last 40 years is not necessarily a good thing. Times are changing. The game, society, economic needs, perception of the game, popularity of the game, and so many other factors, that the excuse of this is how its always been done doesn't hold water. I by no means have the answers to how to "fix it" but, a little over sight can not hurt. Absolute power, absolutely corrupts no matter who is wielding the scepter.....

So you want that power in the hands of the state legislature who will pick whoever they want and then expect those board members to do their jobs within their LEA in addition to running the association? Ha! Good luck!

 

[Appvol]

Would any of you connected posters know if Que Tucker has another job lined up with the NFHS.

 

[Muchadoaboutnothin]

So you want that power in the hands of the state legislature who will pick whoever they want and then expect those board members to do their jobs within their LEA in addition to running the association? Ha! Good luck!

No...no I don't. I think that NCHSAA needs some oversight. They have to be accountable to for some of their decisions. I think they should have helped the schools out much more than they did last year. (paid for game officials or at the very least PPE equipment) If not then, when? I do not think politicians are the answer. (to anything actually) As I've stated earlier, I'm not smart enough or well versed enough to know how "fix it" I do know that it is broken.

 

[btango]

Would any of you connected posters know if Que Tucker has another job lined up with the NFHS.

I think Que was looking at retirement in the year or so. I would think that would be her next move.

 

[btango]

If Que Tucker was a white man this would not even be remotely happening. They see an opportunity to try and remove her and are pouncing.

I agree on they want to remove her. I think if she were a white man without connections we would see the same scenario.

Charlie Adams was a state employee and had deep contacts. Davis Whitfield was polished and very political in the way he dealt with issues. He would give a little bit or be able to "sale" the scenario. With Que you just get the direct answer. If you do not like it, tough.

 

[Hog_1982]

I have an idea that I liked to run to flag poles to see what you think.

For one, I hate the idea of the government being involved in anything. They will f@%* it eventually, it not a matter “if” but “when”, it’s just the nature of politics. So if NCHSAA were to stay, who will oversee it? Who, besides their parents, have a vested interest in seeing what’s best for NC student athlete? It’s our colleges, the presidents and coaches. They should know current trends in sports and what is best for our students. A governing body could be set it up with rolling membership or elected amongst themselves, etc…

Well it’s a passing thought, blow holes in it….

 

[bigdadd11103]

I agree on the remove her. I think if she were a white man without connections we would see the same scenario.

Charlie Adams was a state employee and had deep contacts. Davis Whitfield was polished and very political in the way he dealt with issues. He would give a little bit or be able to "sale" the scenario. With Que you just get the direct answer. If you do not like it, tough.

Agree. Think her being a black woman plays a huge factor. Not all of it , but a great percentage. When you look at the post blaming her most can not even state why they want her gone with clarity. Another factor is get back at Roy for shutting the state down and specifically sports. This is definitely a partisan effort to remove her/change NCHSAA.

Lastly I don't think most know that the money is earmarked for different sources so they don't actually have a liquid $41M. Think Que should have done a better job explaining that. She also should not do interviews without practicing or anticipating how the common fan sees the NCHSAA. The common fan doesn't know the ends and outs so she should focus on successes of the organization, how they are willing to listen to legislators, and how the NCHSAA needs to be in place to ensure the smooth future of NC Athletics. While she is right about her treatment it only enables a segment to be even more aggressive in dismantling. You need to have allies working on your behalf as you mentioned.

Breaking down the NCHSAA's $40 million in assets

The total of $40 million is thrown around often. It is true, the NCHSAA has a total net worth of $40,371,590, as of the end of the fiscal year ending June 30, 2020, according to financial documentation the NCHSAA shared with member schools on Friday.

www.highschoolot.com

 

[Chopper747]

Just call it like I see it. Bottom line folks were mad that there was no high school football in NC in the fall and the limited playoff spots. Bottom line they knew the rules before the spring season. All we heard was they need to play, comradery, teammates losing senior season. ETC ETC. Then a great majority of high profile guys didn't even care to play. They played successfully. IMHO if ESPN hadn't started showing high school games early, and college football hadn't started this wouldn't be an issue as all seasons would have cancelled. AT one point the BIG 10, PAC, and ACC were not going to play, but reversed course when the SEC said yes they were playing. So common sense took over and we adjusted but folks are still mad.

Roy put in mandates that limited athletics and other entities during a period of uncertainty. Was I mad at no football in the fall? Hell yeah I was mad. My son team cancelled season and other leagues were playing. Our state cancelled and others playing. Made no sense to me. Then the COVID deaths' started reaching home and my opinion changed. Id love to see a poll on COVID opinion based on ones that it effected and those it didn't. Just glad we are getting back on the field and players are getting opportunity to ball!

I actually agreed with them for not having a season in the Fall. They needed time to put a protocol in place to protect the student athletes and spectators like they had in the Spring. Alot of people(especially on this board) let their emotions over ride their sense of reason.

 

[Appvol]

 

[btango]

They will walk out tomorrow and announce a compromise. Things will improve. The NCHSAA does a good job, we just want more oversight. The NCHSAA will give into a few things and everyone will be back to work as pretty much regular on Thursday.

Cooler heads have came to the conclusion that replacing this organization is a much bigger task than they expected. Everyone saves face, everyone keeps their jobs.

 

[CPC4LIFE]

Hmmm. Did you call for Charlie Adams and Davis Whitfield's job? Just asking because she holds the exact same policies they did. Were they waste of leaders? The closeted racist are out in full force. State what policy you dislike. what mistake she made in your opinion. State how she changed things differently than her predecessors. State facts, not personal hate.

Listen, this has nothing to do with race! If anybody is racist it’s you. Times evolve and changes have to be made. Zero TV revenue from ESPN along with the petty fines, ineligible teams and the unorganized way of doing things can no longer be sustained. The current NCHSAA leadership needs a overhaul. Charlie Davis and Davis Whitfield would have probably changed with the times. TV was really new covering High Schools. This is apples and oranges. It’s time to overhaul the NCHSAA and yes, I think people with other full time jobs can do a better job! The fact that people are automatically dismissing that a new regime can do a better job is naive and poor guessing. Carry On

 

[Hog_1982]

... I think people with other full time jobs can do a better job! ...

By this, are you referring to the people appointed by the NC politicians ?

 

[Blue and Gold22]

They will walk out tomorrow and announce a compromise. Things will improve. The NCHSAA does a good job, we just want more oversight. The NCHSAA will give into a few things and everyone will be back to work as pretty much regular on Thursday.

Cooler heads have came to the conclusion that replacing this organization is a much bigger task than they expected. Everyone saves face, everyone keeps their jobs.

Straight up media play. Make some noise and get yourself some nice quotes in the local paper to show how " concerned " you are for the local athletes and their families. Rule #1- Find local hot spot issues and insert yourself into them on the side where the votes live.

There was never any interest in actually fixing things. More important to " look" like you are fixing things.

The NCHSAA needs some forward thinking leaders. The landscape of HS athletics is changing at warp speed. I have no idea if Tucker is the right person or part of the problem but I know for certain the NC legislature will never be part of the fix on a day to day basis. Too much posing.

I will say this........ There are a ton of AD's and coaches I have met or heard talk over the past 10-12 years of following closely in NC. I can think of a couple of men and women who could play a big role in implementing change. I would put Bryan Till on the top of that list. Think Carlos Richardson would be an interesting choice as well. Has done a dynamite job with the Chamber athletic dept.

 

[CatholicCougs14]

yes, I think people with other full time jobs can do a better job! The fact that people are automatically dismissing that a new regime can do a better job is naive and poor guessing. Carry On

Yeah, let's say you are a principal. Full day of work running whatever school you are at. Dealing with teachers, parents, discipline, meetings, boards of education, superintendent, curriculum changes for the next year and more...and they're also expected to help run the NCHSAA on top of that? HA! No.

Let's say you're an AD. Full day of work, chasing down forms, making sure everyone is eligible, getting officials for matches, getting buses for away games, getting people to work tickets and concessions for every sport, keeping up on your athletes who might be struggling in the classroom, scheduling games, etc...and they're also expected to help run the NCHSAA on top of all that? Again, HA! No.

 

[Appvol]

Yeah, let's say you are a principal. Full day of work running whatever school you are at. Dealing with teachers, parents, discipline, meetings, boards of education, superintendent, curriculum changes for the next year and more...and they're also expected to help run the NCHSAA on top of that? HA! No.

Let's say you're an AD. Full day of work, chasing down forms, making sure everyone is eligible, getting officials for matches, getting buses for away games, getting people to work tickets and concessions for every sport, keeping up on your athletes who might be struggling in the classroom, scheduling games, etc...and they're also expected to help run the NCHSAA on top of all that? Again, HA! No.

That’s what the TSSAA does.

About TSSAA

TSSAA is a nonprofit, self-supported organization, conceived by school people to promote good sportsmanship and cooperative spirit among member schools.

tssaa.org

 

[Appvol]

It looks like the board of directors is made up of people from schools. Who has more power the board of directors or the
Commissioner office.

Board of Directors - NCHSAA

Officers Chris Blanton, President Assistant SuperintendentWatauga County Schools Send Email Stephen Gainey, Vice-President SuperintendentRandolph County Send Email Robert Jackson, Past-President SuperintendentBuncombe County Send Email Board Members Paige Badgett PrincipalNorth Surry High School...

www.nchsaa.org

 

[Hog_1982]

That’s what the TSSAA does.

About TSSAA

TSSAA is a nonprofit, self-supported organization, conceived by school people to promote good sportsmanship and cooperative spirit among member schools.

tssaa.org

Good for them. It’s a free county, why don’t you move to Tennessee and support TSSAA if it so great