Additionally DF was scheduled to play last season in Atlanta in the Corky Kell classic but covid also canceled that opportunity for them.
Dutch Fork vs Gaffney 5A State Championship game
- Thread starter Vik-Val 86
- Start date
One thing that has not been mentioned. The game was played at Benedict College, an HBCU in Columbia. The stadium has 12,000 bleacher seat and a huge hill. Turf. No track. Plenty of parking but limited egress. It needs some updating but the size and middle of the state is perfect! The home side is has about 8,000 seats and was probably 80% full for Gaffney. About 90% full for DF. Excellent atmosphere! Would love to have that stadium at 85/40 in Greensboro. A&T is geographically central but parking is an issue.
I agree Btango. I think college that size would be ideal here in N.C. for State Championship games.
False. That was West Charlotte that blew the 19 point lead. Up 26-7, and lost at Richmond. Knotts refsued to run the ball that game and kept passing. Weight training was not a factor IMHO.
95 Knotts/WC won over Byrd. KNotts first title. he was 0-3 prior to that.
Page got Knotts in 96 in what may have been one of the best teams(WC) in the state of NC history. They couldn't stop Carlos Dogget, and the defense picked a bad day to have a bad day, To me this was one of Knotts few weaknesses. If he felt he had a superior team he would force the pass or try to win a certain way. At Indy he seemed to learn from his big game mistakes at WC and become a superior coach.
97/98 lost 4 close ones to Richmond County. Felt in 97 they got cheated the 2nd game at RC. Please note 3 of the 4 games were at RC. In that period of time RC was nearly unbeatbale at RC. They had superior talent and resources to CMS schools. DB is not the coach that Knotts is. DB just fit very nicely at RC. Had CMS not had the bus ruling in 99 really think Knotts stays at WC for his entire career and starts the same roll at WC he had at Indy. It became easier to get into Indy, and WC wasn't near as attractive a school.
The game at NCAT would be great! Its more balanced between Charlotte/Raleigh. In Raleigh every year seems like a huge advantage. ALso with NCAT in the Big South now Im sure they are looking at additional recruiting opportunities.
Problem there appears to be parking and their desire to host. A few years ago their concern was interference with a possible FCS playoff bid. NCHSAA would need guarantee the facility was theirs for the contracted date and FCS schools will not / cannot commit to that.
You said "at this point, it's just clear__ you're not a tom knotts fan..."
YOU SURE GUESSED WRONG ON THAT ONE. During the 109 game win streak at Independence, I think I missed 2 games, including one time I was sick, and the other was at a location I did not want to go to. That includes all of the away playoff games, and all of the championships. I even went to the game that ended the streak in Cincinnati, which was a sad occasion. I don't know TK, I have never spoken a word to him, I just respect the product he puts on the field, and enjoyed watching his teams play.
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Not quite! West Charlotte didn't just blow a 19 point lead, Richmond blew them out after West Charlotte's QB (Macklin?) went over to Richmond's side of the field and did a 'Throat Slash" after scoring a TD to go up 26-7. Major mistake!! Michael Waddell took the following kick-off +100 yards for a TD and that was basically the tone for the rest of the game!
ha you’re last post is a real curve ball. first complimentary thing you’ve mention.
what’s up with your initial response to my open enrollment post? it reads like you’re coming out swinging … mad that knotts is getting all the talent to dutch fork (at the expense of others) just like he did back in charlotte.
I'm glad you said 100+ yard TD. LOL> It should have been a touchback but the refs were on RC side bigtime. Ball was clearly kicked in the endzone. BY definition there cant be a 100 yard K/O return in NC HS football. \
Also the FB moved way early on a play but they didn;t call the penalty. Refs took that game over late.
I don't believe he gets all the talent around Columbia, and I don't believe he got all the talent in Charlotte, and I don't believe he ever recruited even 1 player. He says on a youtube video that you can watch that he came to Independence because of Chris Leak. My understanding is Chris Leak was going to attend Independence because his dad played there. Now the people at U of Florida seem to hardly remember who Chris Leak was, but he did lead them to a national championship against Ohio State.
What I do believe is Knotts gets more out of the players he has than anyone else I know of. He builds them up physically, he knows how to motivate them, and he knows how to out think his opponents. In a very complementary way, I think he's a freak. It also shows on the Dutch Fork website that they have 15 varsity coordinators and assistant coaches, so it's not like he does it all himself. At Independence he had some of the best assistants anywhere, but he didn't have 15.
With all that said, you can't win them all, so I congratulate Gaffney. They scored more points, so they deserve the championship. Another thing I like is I have not heard one word about poor officiating. I did hear Dutch Fork had some screw ups, but they didn't blame the lose on anyone but themselves.
Sounds like you're new to this grapevine. Get use to it. They will bash any and all coaches in America. There's more to know about the Queen City Guy - not Guys, but I will let you find out.
2015: L, Dorman (2nd Round)
^last year DF didn’t win state
he’s got 7 state titles (9 appearances): 12, ‘13, ‘16, ‘17, ‘18, ‘19, ‘20
L: ‘14, ‘21
I am getting old and that is awhile ago but did Waddell run the kickoff back in that game? I know he did at the game at Memorial Stadium.
Crest. Pretty sure that was a catch by the future UGA wideout, Raley.
I was looking forward to the rematch but Crest choked on a Bearcats tail and Indy won their first state title starting three or four seniors with only one player that was not in the Indy program the previous year.
I am sure you know but others will not.
Knotts was going to take the South Meck job as it was the closest school to his house. He opted to Indy due to the potential he saw with Chris. The Leak's lived in the neighborhood across the street from the back parking lot. He could literally throw the ball off his back deck onto the school grounds. The family lived in that house from the time Chris started sixth grade.
Chris's brother 'CJ Leak' was a quarterback at Independence before Chris
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Keith Matkins was the WC quarterback i believe
btango said in above, in response to who was the last team to beat Knotts before the streak started at Indy;
“Crest. Pretty sure that was a catch by the future UGA wideout, Raley.”
Do believe that Crest is the correct answer, but the rest of that sentence makes no sense, unless that Indy catch has something to do with the defeat by Crest.
So on the way to Indy’s first title in 2000, Crest defeated them, but missed out on a rematch by losing to another playoff team?
Wasn’t that during Crest’s run in 4A (no subdivisions) including winning the State championship in 1994 and again in 1996?
Makes all the sense if you were there.
Crest beat Indy second game of the year at Crest by three. Knotts first year starting four senior early. It was a real good "JV team." Crest lost to Anson second round of the playoffs and then to Indy in the semifinals. Everyone was waiting on the rematch at the Sid. Crest did not hold up their end of the deal.
Correct. Impressive football / basketball player. Initially went to South Carolina and finished at A&T.
Got it. Thanks.
So there was a controversial catch/no catch call that impacted the result of the game.
The reason we asked about Crest was to confirm their play at the top championship levels of 4A during that period.
There are posters on here that have challenged that Shelby has not played top level 4A programs. As you know, Shelby has played Crest every year (except Covid last year) since 1968, including Crest’s run at the top of 4A, even defeating the Chargers in the years surrounding Crest as unified 4A Champions in 94 and 96.
The posters here that challenge Shelby vs top 4A play will still not accept factual history.
knotts is on record saying he’s “motivated by fear of failure” — scared to death he’s not going to succeed. ha he’s not sure if that’s right/healthy, but it’s the way he’s built.
5 assistants, 15 assistants, 100+ assistants … doesn’t matter, all background noise and accessory pieces 🙂 (kidding, but you know what i mean) — knotts has his hand on EVERYTHING in the program. he’s cut from the same cloth as saban and urban meyer vs the ceo style coach who delegates a lot more (dabo, mack brown, ed o, pete carroll)
Knotts WAS Indy and Knotts IS DF.
Chris Leak was as good as advertised. He did his part, but got very little help til Urban, Tebow, Percy Harvin got to town. He’s still UF all time passing yards leader and #2 total td’s. It’s more timing with him than anything else. Two figures (urban and tebow) who will be on the all-time UF mt rushmore showed up right on his tail.
The distance between UF and Leak now is obviously over the off field incident. nothing ever came of it … and right or wrong, it is what it is. due process doesn’t matter anymore in the pr world/court of public opinion … just the mere accusation is enough to bury anyone these days.
Leak was some kind of impressive. Threw the prettiest spiral you’ve ever seen.
Looked at the numbers. No bias here, just the numbers:
1996 Crest vs Shelby 14-7
1996 Crest vs Kings Mtn 28-28 tie
1996 Crest vs Independence 20-14 closest win
1996 Crest vs Douglas Byrd 20-7 state title
1994 Crest vs Shelby 16-3
1994 Crest vs South Iredell. 10-3 2nd closest win
1994 Crest vs West Charlotte 20-13 2nd closest win
1994 Crest vs Mt Tabor 13-7 closest win
1994 Crest vs Jacksonville 28-7 state title
1996 Crest vs Shelby 14-7
1996 Crest vs Kings Mtn 28-28 tie
1996 Crest vs Independence 20-14 closest win
1996 Crest vs Douglas Byrd 20-7 state title
1994 Crest vs Shelby 16-3
1994 Crest vs South Iredell. 10-3 2nd closest win
1994 Crest vs West Charlotte 20-13 2nd closest win
1994 Crest vs Mt Tabor 13-7 closest win
1994 Crest vs Jacksonville 28-7 state title
Leak was the best QB and player I ever saw period. Won state as a sophomore and never looked back. Set every state record for passing and a few national records as well. Was labeled the Chosen One at Florida before Tebow. He had three different OCs his first three years at Florida. Won and won and won and set records to nobody's satisfaction at Florida. Was called to step aside by the fans for freshman Tebow. Leak threw TDs, Tebow scored on goal line. Leak was MVP of the National title game and as mentioned above has all the UF passing records. I don't like when people say Tebow led UF to two titles. Leak led them to the first. Their second ever national title. In UFs 100th season of football no less...
Went to the Bears. Played well in the preseason for what chance he was given but Bears thought enough of him to keep Rex Grossman and Kyle Horton and cut Leak.
Obviously not a great head coach. Incident aside, his record wasn't good at a pretty successful school. Wish him the best.
Went to the Bears. Played well in the preseason for what chance he was given but Bears thought enough of him to keep Rex Grossman and Kyle Horton and cut Leak.
Obviously not a great head coach. Incident aside, his record wasn't good at a pretty successful school. Wish him the best.
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The difference in Charlotte football since the 1990's to now is night and day. A lot of factors that have been discussed here. Population growth. Panthers and the football people connected to the team that made Charlotte home resulting in the personal and skill training at a high level plus the interest in the team. Unlimited weight youth football was huge and replaced the middle schools or added to those programs. Funds to put sufficient weight rooms in schools often coming from effort by coaches and boosters. Tom Knotts. He changed the dynamic. Some others followed and did it with their spin, Newsome, Palmeiri.
several national analyst/publications have chris leak as the all-time best high school qb. still blows my minds that he had two P5 offers (wake and s carolina) before playing a single down of high school football. he was the literal textbook definition of “prodigy”
if only he had his brothers (cj leak) size … i think he would’ve had a looong nfl career.
Leak won three titles, sophomore first one in 2000. Knotts and Leak worked well together. Leak was very cerebral and he was not easily bothered. Knotts was able to try things with Leak that grew from there.
The 2000 Indy team was the weakest until the 2007. A lot of talent but VERY young.
The 2000 Indy team was the weakest until the 2007. A lot of talent but VERY young.
Correct. Dunno why I said freshman first. Maybe because I heard of him before he was ever a freshman lol?
Chris Leak as a prodigy was like the Bobby Fischer of football to me as compared to chess. You knew who he was from the age of 12 or 13 because of CJ.
Btango It was Michael "Rabbit" Waddell that ran the kick back. He was the biggest difference maker football player I've ever seen in a game. Think part of teh issue of why they didn;t blow it dead was that he got such a good jump coming out of the endzone and the WC players frooze looking for the touchback call. It was over a 100 yard return so the refs should have blew it dead easily. The best play Waddell made and the play that I think frustrated Knotts the most was the 3rd down at Memorial stadium when Rabbit went 98 yards on 3rd and long I believe. Think Fred Staton could have won the game for WC, but he and Knotts just didn;t seem to completely mesh and reach full potential.
Unlimited football changed the game in the queen city. If your child is playing POP Warner right now stop it. Its a detriment. Unlimited leagues fueled Indy, Butler and MC. Now they are in Fayetteville, Richmond, and the Triad area. Its made football so much better in NC., but it started in Charlotte.
Also remember CJ Leak was the first well known big time transfer in CMS. He went from South Meck to Indy. Many thought Chris was headed to WC in 00, before the Knotts move. The Leaks were very familiar withthe westside of Charlotte so a move to WC wouldnt have been an issue.
Unlimited football changed the game in the queen city. If your child is playing POP Warner right now stop it. Its a detriment. Unlimited leagues fueled Indy, Butler and MC. Now they are in Fayetteville, Richmond, and the Triad area. Its made football so much better in NC., but it started in Charlotte.
Also remember CJ Leak was the first well known big time transfer in CMS. He went from South Meck to Indy. Many thought Chris was headed to WC in 00, before the Knotts move. The Leaks were very familiar withthe westside of Charlotte so a move to WC wouldnt have been an issue.
ha i came across this quote from an old chris leak interview/article and instantly thought of your “changing of the guard” comment.
“Looking back on my high school career, I would have to say that my most memorable game was our 2000 NCHSAA quarterfinal game with Richmond County, which was ranked No. 4 in the nation at the time. We had to travel there, but we won in a big way. Richmond County was then and still is a highly respected program with a lot of high school all-Americans, and many players who went on to play in college and in the NFL. In my eyes, that win got us over the hump as being a nationally ranked program.”
Good post.
But here is the rest of the story.
Shelby vs Crest
1993 Shelby 24-17
1994 Crest 16-3 Crest unified 4A State Champs
1995 Shelby 44-21
1996 Crest 14-7 Crest unified 4A State Champs
1997 Shelby 18-7 Shelby unified 2A State Runner up
1998 Crest 14-7 Shelby unified 2A State Champs
I was on the opposite end. Still remember WC players really pissed. Knotts felt he got one taken away there but Knotts a few years later is taking the win not trying to keep scoring.
The run at Memorial the next year came off of D call that worked perfect to what the O did. Huge hole with the safeties up. By the time they adjusted Waddell was gone.
Yeah Knotts matured a lot coaching wise at Indy. You are correct at Indy he takes the win. TBH Knotts could have easily won the states in 91,92, 93,95,96.97,98 if he coached a tad more conservatively like he did at Indy. The KNotts at INdy/DF is much more of a game manager than at Harding/WC. Still the same genius but game management is so much greater. Best highschool coach of all time.
Btw, I pulled those for the express purpose of showing Shelby vs 4A champion caliber Crest. It was the main point of the exercise because I want to look at what Shelby does against Crest, South Pointe, possibly Independence, Butler, Mallard Creek, Richmond, Vance and Wake Forest level types.
