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the state of Murphy boy's basketball

mbdfan

Well-Known Member
Mar 17, 2007
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It wasn't that long ago that the varsity boys at Murphy were on top of the SMC but those days seem a distant memory with the way the last few seasons have gone. Since their last sectional final appearance in 2011, the Murphy program has been on a sharp and steady decline. Things finally hit rock bottom this season when the team only won 5 games, two of those wins coming against a school with less than 50 total students in their high school.

However, much to my surprise, there are apparently no plans for a coaching change. That really says it all about how the athletic department views the basketball program and all sports not named football, given what has transpired. Coach Payne has been a faithful servant to Murphy basketball but the program is in a tailspin that is unlikely to improve with him in charge. I commend him for all he has done in his years at Murphy but it's time for a new voice, a new face, a new direction.

Coach Payne has been in charge for 15 years now, the program started out strong under his watch benefiting from a great run of talent early in his tenure. After that group graduated in 2002-2003 the program suffered through several years of mediocrity before returning to prominence behind what was arguably the best run of basketball talent in Murphy history. A group backed by the likes of 2 time SMC POY Zack Lovingood and standout guards Dwayne Neal and Devantae Sudderth the Bulldogs enjoyed 4 straight SMC conference tournament titles and 3 straight regular season SMC titles.

While those regular season accomplishments were impressive, those teams never got over the hump in the postseason, managing only one regionals appearance during that stretch. And despite having the deepest roster in the history of the SMC with the 2009-10 team, a team that went 10 deep and whose second five were better than any starting five in the rest of the conference, that team only managed a sectional finals appearance that season. In that sectionals game against Hendersonville the Bulldogs lead much of the game, however early in the 4th quarter SMC POY Lovingood picked up his 4th foul with the Bulldogs leading. Payne took Lovingood out and the Bearcats preceded to cut the Murphy lead and with home crowd behind them the Bearcats took the momentum and eventually the lead, while Lovingood remained on the bench. Payne finally reinserted Lovingood but it was too late, the Bearcats held onto their late lead and moved on to regionals. A team that was plenty talented enough to have won it all that season, sent home after the 3rd round..

While the talent on the team is clearly not on par with that of the past, there is still plenty of talent in the school. Some of that talent either isn't playing at all or quitting in the middle of their high school career. The last few years there have been several players, starters even, who have not returned for their junior or senior seasons and others who have simply not bothered to play after JV. This season alone there were 3 certain starters who did not suit up, one transferred out and the other two elected not to play after having started the previous season (one for Murphy, the other for Hayesville JV). Those three players: a 6'8 post, a 6'4 post and a 6'0 guard would've drastically upgraded the talent level. Unfortunately this is not an isolated incident, roster attrition has been happening for a while. That speaks to a disconnect between the coach and his players/potential players, unfortunately this issue could continue to manifest itself without a change in coach.

While last year was indeed the low point, next season promises to be as bad or if possible worse. The Murphy JV team showed well and offered some hope for the future but several of these kids will not bother suiting up for the varsity team because of the current perception of the varsity program, real or perceived. Then there will likely be the same annual defections from what is already a paper thin and largely untalented varsity roster. While the Murphy varsity roster last season was constructed of many kids who would never see the floor on previous Murphy teams, next year's team might have a hard time even fielding a complete roster.

Yes, this was long winded but I hate to see a once proud program reach this ultimate low point. The athletic department has sent a loud and clear message with their coaching decisions in regards to basketball and baseball. That message appears to be that they're unconcerned with the rest of the athletic department as long as the football program remains successful. But when the state of these programs starts causing talented young footballers to transfer to schools that still take other sports seriously, perhaps only then will some things change. But I and many others won't be holding their breath though.


This post was edited on 3/18 9:14 PM by mbdfan
 
the 6'8 guy never was on the team and left and went back home because his mother had health problems ,the 6"4 kid hadn't wanted to play basketball for years nor did he want to play football either the other kid that started for Hayesville I don't know who that was unless your talking about Bryce , and I assure you the reason he didn't play wasn't because of coach Payne , and if you want to know what happened to the Lovingood teams , just ask Zack when you see him.
 
Originally posted by dogtuff:

the 6'8 guy never was on the team and left and went back home because his mother had health problems ,the 6"4 kid hadn't wanted to play basketball for years nor did he want to play football either the other kid that started for Hayesville I don't know who that was unless your talking about Bryce , and I assure you the reason he didn't play wasn't because of coach Payne
I wasn't trying to imply that Josh Falls or Bryce Clapsaddle didn't play because of Coach Payne. I know Falls wasn't ever officially on the team but my point was had he not transferred he would've been an impact starter from Day 1 and an absolute force in the SMC. Bryce would've started and been a real contributor as well.

What I was trying to show was that there was in fact some real basketball talent in the school this season that could've played but didn't. I especially wanted to point that out because some people have said the only reason the basketball team has been down recently is because there is no basketball talent in the school right now, which is false.

Ultimately the only way things are going to get turned around is to have all or most of your best talent out there competing and playing and I'm just not sure Coach Payne is going to be able to convince enough of them to play next season to get the program back to a winning level.

I think the only way some of them are going to play now is with a coaching change. Sometimes it's best for a fresh start for all parties involved and I think we're at that point with Murphy basketball. I just think it's time for some new ideas, voice and direction for the program. It's nothing personal against David, this type of thing can happen to any coach eventually.

If he's going to stay on as coach for next season though he has to find a way to get at least a few of the talented kids that aren't playing right now to come out for the team and he also to convince the more talented JV kids to stay with the program and play varsity next year. Personally I think it's going to be a real tough to do all that because some of them just aren't going play with the way the perception of the team is right now but he has to try, do whatever it takes.


This post was edited on 3/18 10:18 PM by mbdfan
 
These are the the cracks that will bring down a total athletic program. Long gone are the days of all 3 big sports where Murphy ruled . And the girls for that matter . But you will have football... Which is what everyone seems to want.. It's really sad how far they fell .. They should be fighting with cherokee rville and Hayesville for the title every year ..
 
Originally posted by BravesGWY:
These are the the cracks that will bring down a total athletic program. Long gone are the days of all 3 big sports where Murphy ruled . And the girls for that matter . But you will have football... Which is what everyone seems to want.. It's really sad how far they fell .. They should be fighting with cherokee rville and Hayesville for the title every year ..
so is the emphasis in Cherokee on the big 3 sports? Or just basketball ?
 
Never said we was ... Read my friend ... I said its a shame. Put your emphasis on football doesn't bother me ... Cherokee tries but with a little over 250 kids it's difficult to be very good in everything .... I'm just saying you guys used to be good at all 3 .. Now not so much ..
 
Just to set the record straight the young man from Hayesville did not play basketball his last year at HHS, only played his freshman year.
 
The problem with schools being good in all 3 sports , it seems were in an era of kids specializing in single sports , and with college coaches , and high level orthopedics surgeons saying High School kids shouldn't specialize , parents continue to think that is the way to go, another thing in my opinion that hurts Murphy ,our football team has played 78 games in the last 5 years , so I think kids fight a little burn out , so maybe success in certain sports hurts other sports. { example: Murphy kids think their best shot at State would be in football , Hayesville kids may think basketball } what is the boards opinion on this ?
 
Dogtuff, at Albemarle we have had good success in football, basketball, baseball and track. This year the basketball team went 26-1 and just about the whole team was made up of football players. Same in track but not so much in baseball. The success of the basketball team has a lot to do with the coach. He has been here almost 30 years and is very good at what he does and everybody likes him. Coaching has been a big reason for our success in all sports, but football has taken a little bit of a hit as we have had 3 different coaches in the last 3 years. Its makes a big difference. As most of you know we are fighting for our very existence as a school , as the local school board is considering closeing the school. Hope is doesn't happen but it could. We have had a handful of athletes that have carried us in ALL sports for as long as I can remember.
 
Originally posted by dogtuff:
The problem with schools being good in all 3 sports , it seems were in an era of kids specializing in single sports , and with college coaches , and high level orthopedics surgeons saying High School kids shouldn't specialize , parents continue to think that is the way to go, another thing in my opinion that hurts Murphy ,our football team has played 78 games in the last 5 years , so I think kids fight a little burn out , so maybe success in certain sports hurts other sports. { example: Murphy kids think their best shot at State would be in football , Hayesville kids may think basketball } what is the boards opinion on this ?
I'm with you about specialization being ridiculous. With it being the first day of the NCAA tournament, I've linked to some video of Willie Cauley-Stein, maybe the best college basketball player in the country, also being a great high school football player. I could have done the same for Ron Baker, Pat Connaughton (who also has an Orioles contract waiting on him) and plenty of other people who will be playing big time basketball the next few days even though they didn't specialize in high school. I understand why parents push specialization, because everybody wants to tell their kids they can be whatever they want if they work hard enough...but the ultimate reality is that scholarships come down to a lot of innate and genetic things, whether you spend your time specializing or not. Plus there are numerous articles from sport scientists indicating that specialization is counterproductive until the latter teen years. But parents will do what parents will do...

I'm not sure if I'm totally on board with success in one sport necessarily hurting success in other sports, in terms of kids choosing where to go based on that, because I think, at least at the 1A and 2A levels, you can develop a reputation of excelling in multiple sports with the same athletes (East Lincoln, Shelby, Plymouth, etc). However, I do agree that it's harder to get the ball rolling in basketball season when you start practice a month and a half late and your players come in tired, banged up, and coming down off an emotional high.

Willie Cauley Stein High School Football
 
Don't blame just the parents and players that want to specialize, coaches take some of the blame also. In football kids need to be in the weight room 4-5 days a week. In the summer we have team camp, position camps, 7 on 7 and skill development. Basketball wants their players at open gyms, skill development and summer camps. Baseball wants their kids at the cage, playing in the summer leagues and in fall leagues. Colleges are also some of the problem, they don't scout at the high school level much anymore(baseball and basketball). It is at AAU tournaments and exposure events where players first draw attention. They can be seen by more coaches in one game than in their entire career in 1A. And for the most part they are playing much better competition than in 1A.
 
There are situations where I can understand specialization and others where I cant. If you have a kid that is a standout player in one sport and a reserve in another sport it makes sense to me but those kids are not the problem. When your stand out overall athletes start specializing then that is what hurts.

There was a point made above that really makes a lot of sense to me. I do not think that it is the in season work that keeps kids from playing multiple sports but rather the offseason work. Take a 1a typical 3 sport athlete, and lets say that his best chance to play in college is baseball. When his regular season ends, he would want to spend his summer playing legion or AAU or whatever classification that he spends his summer time playing. While he is doing this, his football coach expects him to be in the weight room minimum of 4 days per week, and participating in 7 on 7 stuff. Meanwhile, the basketball coach expects him to go to team camp and practice and play basketball for a minimum of 3 weeks during the summer if not join a AAU team. While all of this is going on, his parents expect him to work to make enough money to pay for his car insurance, and since he is 16 and what is really important to him is his girlfriend. He quickly discovers that there is not enough of him to go around. He then decides that he is not going to play one or two of the other sports, and our term is specialization. Truth is that he will not likely spend any more time on the one sport that he has chosen to participate in. He is not really specializing, he is just trying to make room in his life to have a life. And sadly, I do not see a way to stop this. Even when I played, 100 years ago, there was always overlap between sports, and it was not a bit unusual for you small forward on the basketball team to spend 20 minutes after basketball practice throwing because he is also the teams #1 pitcher. That is not the problem. The problem is the summer time, and the season following that sport. Every coach is pushed to have successful programs, and you cannot have successful programs by putting your balls up at the end of the season and getting them back out when the season starts back next year. The coaches are doing what they have to do to have a chance to keep their job, but in the meantime, too much is being asked of kids. What is the solution? Danged if I know, I am way better at identifying problems than I am at coming up with solutions.
 
Originally posted by recycled2:
Don't blame just the parents and players that want to specialize, coaches take some of the blame also. In football kids need to be in the weight room 4-5 days a week. In the summer we have team camp, position camps, 7 on 7 and skill development. Basketball wants their players at open gyms, skill development and summer camps. Baseball wants their kids at the cage, playing in the summer leagues and in fall leagues. Colleges are also some of the problem, they don't scout at the high school level much anymore(baseball and basketball). It is at AAU tournaments and exposure events where players first draw attention. They can be seen by more coaches in one game than in their entire career in 1A. And for the most part they are playing much better competition than in 1A.
That's fair. But you would think (or hope) that, at the 1A level, coaches would realize that being a little more flexible with their expectations is better for everybody involved in the long run because of the limited talent pool.
 
Originally posted by ObserveAndReport:
Originally posted by recycled2:
Don't blame just the parents and players that want to specialize, coaches take some of the blame also. In football kids need to be in the weight room 4-5 days a week. In the summer we have team camp, position camps, 7 on 7 and skill development. Basketball wants their players at open gyms, skill development and summer camps. Baseball wants their kids at the cage, playing in the summer leagues and in fall leagues. Colleges are also some of the problem, they don't scout at the high school level much anymore(baseball and basketball). It is at AAU tournaments and exposure events where players first draw attention. They can be seen by more coaches in one game than in their entire career in 1A. And for the most part they are playing much better competition than in 1A.
That's fair. But you would think (or hope) that, at the 1A level, coaches would realize that being a little more flexible with their expectations is better for everybody involved in the long run because of the limited talent pool.
Yes hopefully it doesn't happen, but sadly it does. Coaches look out for their teams.
 
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